My First Million: Work Like Ocean's 11, Sam Bankman-Fried, and the Deepfake Dilemma

Hubspot Podcast Network Hubspot Podcast Network 5/26/22 - 1h 8m - PDF Transcript

All right.

Quick break to tell you about another podcast that we're interested in right now, HubSpot

just launched a Shark Tank rewatch podcast called Another Bite.

Every week, the hosts relive the latest and greatest pitches from Shark Tank, from Squatty

Potty to the Mench on a Bench to Ring Doorbell, and they break down why these pitches were

winners or losers, and each company's go-to-market strategy, branding, pricing, valuation, everything.

Basically all the things you want to know about how to survive the tank and scale your

company on your own.

If you want to give it a listen, you can find Another Bite on whatever podcast app you listen

to, like Apple or Spotify or whatever you're using right now.

All right.

Back to the show.

I think the future of work is like Ocean's Eleven because you're going to have your crew

the same way that Ocean's Eleven is this badass team.

Are we good?

I'm a whole different guy, Sampar.

You're looking at a man four days in to clean eating.

And guess what?

Are you really?

Now I'm on time.

Guess what?

Now my kids love me.

Guess what?

The stocks went up today for the first time in like five months.

So a lot of things are going well here.

What are you eating?

I'm just like, I don't know if this is healthy or not, but I'm very heavy meat and protein

right now and just like nothing bad and not eating late, not doing bad stuff.

Dude, listen to this thing that I'm doing.

It's called My Body Tutor.

Have you heard of it?

I have heard of this.

Is it like a text messaging thing?

Somebody like...

It's way more primitive than that.

So basically I pay them either six or $700 a month.

I don't remember if it's $5.99 or $6.99.

And this woman named Heather, she's like my coach, she just calls me every single morning

and I have to tell her what I ate, what I'm going to eat today.

And then she tell and I write down on my fitness pal what I've eaten the day before

and she'll say yesterday was bad or good.

Here's why.

Tell me what you're going to eat today.

That's all it is.

It's a five minute phone call.

It's amazing.

You should try this.

It's actually quite good.

I should try this.

The fact that I don't want to try this tells me that I absolutely should try this.

So I think I might.

I think I might do it because, yeah, I don't know, I'll tell you what's embarrassing.

What's embarrassing was that a day and a half into just eating clean is just not like, oh,

my daughter's leftover macaroni and cheese.

All right, let me just eat these three spoons before I put it in the sink or like, oh, there's

a free cookie here at this thing.

Let me just grab that.

A day and a half in, I felt a difference, which tells me how poorly I've been eating.

If I could feel a difference just from a day and a half of eating perfectly right.

What do you eat normally that's bad?

Like are you talking about like process?

Just clean me just like no sugar and not processed.

No sugar, not processed.

Not like late night snacking or whatever, like just cutting it off at a certain time.

And then not like, okay, you know, I've been, you know, what will happen to me sometimes

is I'll be like, oh, I'm working.

I got calls.

I got the pot.

I got all this stuff going on.

I'm excited.

I look up.

It's 2 p.m.

I haven't eaten anything.

And I'm like, all right, the next edible item in sight is just getting like devoured,

right?

It's like a stress eat at that point.

Yeah.

It's getting got.

Oh, you thought there's party size of Doritos was for a party?

No, it's getting got right now.

And so, so you ever heard of, you ever heard of someone doing a line of Oreos?

It's when you get the Oreo tray and it's got like three columns and you do a whole line.

You just take a whole column out in one sitting.

That's something that would happen before, you know, just on an inconsistent basis.

I'm down, man.

I'd like to do Oreo cereal.

You just get a gallon of milk and a sleeve of Oreos.

And just just go to town.

So I'm a boy with you, man.

I like all that stuff too, but you just can't do it.

Yeah, I can't do it.

All right.

So we got a bunch of stuff.

Let's do let's do some of these topics.

I don't know where you want to start.

Oh, actually, I just see my topics.

I don't see yours.

Do you have any?

I had a few.

We went through a lot of them the other day, but well, well, one thing that is quick.

The classic.

We went through a lot of them the other day.

The classic.

No, I'm usually really prepared, but do you see that Conan O'Brien's thing got acquired

team Cocoa?

Yeah, you texted this.

So what is it?

So he has a podcast network or is just his one podcast?

It's a podcast network, but I think he's the heavy hitter and it's sold 160 million or

something you said, right?

Like a pretty 150 to 200.

I forget the number, but they have 16 million downloads a month.

We have two.

Oh, MFM sized.

Yeah.

We have two or three million a month.

So what does that put us worth?

And ours is a business like it's the people listening.

You guys are richer than like Conan O'Brien's audience.

Yeah.

And we're way better looking and way more funny.

So, you know, if you just take his multiple and you say, all right, divide by eight, we

don't do public math.

So that's unfortunately just the problem.

We're not going to know how much worth because we go into public math and move it on to the

next topic.

I think it's $20 million.

Who?

Who bought it, by the way?

Serious.

Serious body.

Okay.

So he's going to like go exclusively to them.

Yeah.

But honestly, I'm going to call our shot a little bit.

I don't think that it's going to be that crazy that in a year or two, we get paid like 10

or 20 million a year to license out to Spotify or something like that.

I wouldn't do that.

That sounds a little crazy.

10 or 20 million.

I think sounds a little crazy.

But then again, like it sounded crazy that, you know, like, for example, the ringer when

they got bought by Spotify, so they were a sports network of podcasts led by Bill Simmons.

And Bill Simmons was sort of like the Conan O'Brien of that network.

And they got bought, I think, for $200 million.

And what's crazy is it's not even exclusive to Spotify, which is just like wild to me

that that's how favorable these deals are in the same way that Joe Rogan, when he got

paid by Spotify, he had to take it off of YouTube, but he's still on Apple Podcast,

which is pretty crazy.

So when the ringer sold to Spotify, $200 million, I think they were doing about $15 million

in revenue when they got bought for $200 million.

Crazy.

That is absolutely crazy.

And was it only one podcast?

No, they actually had a bunch.

It was like, yeah, 12 maybe or something like that, but they've got a few winners.

It's like three winners.

And then like, it's like one big winner, two small winners, and then a bunch of like long

tail stuff that kind of doesn't matter in terms of like how big it is.

But also, I think for them, you know, the thing is, it's not like they were bought for

a revenue multiple.

It's not like Spotify was like, you know what, we're going to buy this revenue multiple because

you know, that's going to get priced at a favorable rate in the market here.

It was just like, we need to strategically move into podcasting, okay, go get Rogan,

go get the ringer, go get the one that got bought that's like a bar alley is that startup

one, Gimlet.

So they bought Gimlet also for a lot of money.

They bought Anchor, that podcasting tool that sucked like not sucked.

The tool was cool, but nobody was using it.

They bought that thing for like 150 million, which is crazy to me.

And so they, they, they splurged and I think, you know, that splurge, that splurge window

is now closed.

Well, listen, if you're a listener, and if you work at Sirius or Spotify or something

like this and you want to throw a few dollars out of it.

We are motivated by money.

Yeah.

We do things because people pay me money.

So we can have that conversation.

I enjoy commas with many zeros around them.

Yeah.

Down.

So anyway, if you're listening and you want to make an introduction or you want to help

us get paid.

Can we talk about this?

Okay.

So I have a few ideas.

So I have a couple of things I want to talk to you about later.

I want to talk to you about this new version of plastic surgery that I think is interesting.

I want to talk to you about virtual reality project that I saw that was actually doing

pretty significant revenue.

I want to talk to you about this like bionic reading thing.

So I have a few things I want to talk about.

But first, can we talk about this meme, the drink and a colo meme?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So Sam texts me while we're on vacation.

And I was like, dude, this is perfect for the pod because you saw a tweet from Moise

who came on the podcast the same day or the next day or something like that.

And Moise said something like, I don't know, can you pull it up with the exact phrasing

is?

But he, he was just tweeting about some business thing.

He's like, oh yeah, I was drinking a cola with the founders of this blah, blah, blah

app.

And, and then he said some business thing and Sam rightfully pointed out how hilarious

that intro is of like, I was enjoying a cola with my friends and then we decided to start

talking about, you know, cash flow.

I met with the triple whale founders yesterday for a cola.

They were exhausted from a day of traveling, but we all, we all left with so much energy.

Genghis Khan conquered 30% of the world during his reign.

We want to do the same, except the world is now the digital marketing share.

But the intro was, I met with these founders for a cola.

That tweet is hilarious on multiple levels.

First of all, the benefit of these founders for a cola, hilarious, who drinks cola?

I don't know.

Who says cola?

First of all, that's like, who smokes and drinks soda still?

I don't know.

Second, who calls it cola?

Third, why is that relevant for the tweet?

It's so funny.

We have to do a series of tweets where it's like, we talk about something profound, but

the intro is like, you know, so I was getting some caramels with a friend or a, yeah, so

like it just got to be like the most random stuff.

Snapping off a beef jerky with my buddy, Timmy, and he told me about how self storage

market is really going under right now.

Who says a cola?

Do you think that's what he meant is a cult like he sat down for like Pepsi?

It's like, you know, at a board meeting today, we poured out a peppermint schnapps and decided

to like.

So that's my new like, if we ever do an event or a conference, it's like, that's the pass

code.

Like, how do we know you're real and you're a real listener, you're real loyal is like,

you need to be able to come up and tell us a story.

Tell us a story that starts with like, you know, you know, so I was eating a dunk of

roux and, you know, just had a question or we got to like do the most extreme thing

ever where it's like, so I was doing this thing where you suck on a piece of candy and

then spit it in your friend's mouth to the change the taste.

Anyway, we're talking about, that's important, but we were talking about the economics.

No, it's so good, it's so good.

That's my new shit.

You know, my last shit was I have moved straight to the end because of Elon and I haven't

moved straight to the end.

That's done.

The other shit is my buddy, we're doing the spaghetti thing where we each take one into

the noodle and suck on it, but when we got close to the noodle, we realized the problem

with COVID.

And then we started talking about the recession and how it's moving, you know, that's pretty

good.

Drinking a cola.

All right.

Wait, really quick.

Do you think that he was trying to be funny?

No, that's the best part.

I think he was just saying like, I think he was just saying what happened and that in

his mind is what happened.

Even the second part of the tweet alone, take the cola part out, just being like, I met

with the veterans of Drupal Whale and you know, Genghis Khan, if you bring Genghis Khan

into whatever sentence you're saying, you are dramatically overestimating whatever you're

doing in life.

It's like the same way where if anyone's like, yeah, you know the way that Tesla came out

with the Roadster first, so we're also doing like a high end of digital marketing attribution

before we go low end.

It's like, no, you're making yourself equivalent to Tesla and like, anytime you're like, Genghis

Khan conquered 30% of the earth, whatever the next sentence is, better be fucking lit.

And instead his was like, we're doing the same for digital marketing.

And so that also was like, you know, just hilarious to me.

Is cola, was Mois born in America?

Yeah, he's born.

No, they were, I think they were born in Pakistan and then they moved when they were like seven

or five or something.

Is that like a Pakistani thing where they call like soda cola?

I don't know, maybe, because actually I have a cousin who came over from India about like

when he was like 20 and he would always be like, hey, can I have a Coca-Cola light?

And we're like, what?

What did you just say?

And he'd like say, he would always say the full name of things.

And it was like, okay, yeah, like, oh, is this covered by nationwide insurance?

It's like, yeah, it is, funny you ask.

This is awesome, we could go with this forever.

Yeah, it's too much for me.

All right, so I want to talk to you about a couple of ideas.

Did you see this thing about, I have this link in here you can see.

It's this, the surgery that guys are getting that costs $75,000, but it'll make you three

inches taller.

Did you see this thing?

They break your.

That's a great thing to text to like your friend who like is a little short.

You're like, hey, good news.

Good news.

Congrats.

Yeah.

Congrats.

Heard about the break, the scientific breakthrough.

Oh, what happened?

You're a vaccine?

No.

They break your femur and they'll put a rod in and it'll make you three to five inches

taller.

And this thing is like apparently just popping off.

And I've just been looking at this like, it's like, what are the big problems that nobody

wants to admit to, but are real?

I just think that that's an interesting prompt for business ideas.

So it's like, our buddy Craig Clemens does this where like one of his products is like,

one of his best selling products, right?

He's got these DTC companies that do like, I don't know, over a hundred million a year

in sales as part of his like bootstrapped thing.

And I think one of their products was like some toenail fungus remover.

And it's like just like the unsexiest thing, but it's like common and it's actually something

that people really want to get rid of, right?

Or they were something that people really want to change.

And I think height is another one.

I've seen this now in two places.

So first I saw this surgery thing and I was like, oh, that's funny.

Like the article was written almost like, can you believe this crazy thing?

How tall are doing?

And in my mind, I was like, yeah, I can totally believe that.

I think being three to five inches taller is fucking awesome.

Yeah, exactly.

Like if you're going to your breast implants or like a fake ass, like, yeah, this is, this

is I'm on board.

Exactly.

And I was like, you know, being taller is like, you know, just awesome.

Like if you gave me three inches, I'd be very happy and I'd earn more money and I'd be

more liked.

Like that's just a thing.

Like Ben, how tall are you?

Like six four, right?

Yeah.

Yes.

Correct.

You already know, you already know the advantage.

Yeah.

You're, you're so privileged, dude.

You shouldn't even talk to the podcast.

You're so privileged.

You're speaking from tall privilege right now.

Check your privilege.

Yeah.

You need to check your tall privilege at the door right now.

I had a girlfriend one time, not like a girlfriend, but like a girl I was familiar with who

said, who told me, I can't tell if I think you're actually handsome or if you're just

tall.

Yeah.

By the way, Sam, in your course, there's a review from me saying like Sam's copywriting

course.

It works.

I got three extra inches in two weeks or something like that.

And did you write that because people keep coming to be like, that's so funny.

Yeah.

They're like, dude, that's so funny.

And it's either I blacked out or somebody's just impersonating me because I don't remember

writing that.

But it's hilarious.

Basically, if you go to trycopythat.com and you scroll all the way down like on the sales

page, you'll see like a, and it says Sean Perry, the, and then the review is loved it

so much.

It gave me three extra inches, totally five out of five stars.

I thought you did that, which was funny.

But the fact that someone else did it and wrote your, your name is funny.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Exactly.

Dude, I knew a guy.

Yeah.

So this is an interesting question.

We, I know a guy named Nat and he's got an app.

It's called like, I forget what exactly what it's called, but it helps you with a kegel.

Do you know what a kegel is?

I don't, I think, I think a kegel is the exercise that you do or is it the muscle that needs

to be stronger?

It's the exercise.

It's the exercise that you have to do that keeps you from pre-jacking early.

I guess that's a oxymoron.

Or I like how you just shortened it.

You're like, if I just say half the word, it's half as bad.

The, the other thing, I think, I think women do it, which is like supposed to be just like

good for you in general, but also like for women, it kind of tightens.

It helps them feel, helps, helps sex feel better for them.

I think it's the idea.

Um, well, this guy, and he created an app for men to keep you from just jacking early.

And I think he kills it.

Let me guess.

It's not doing pretty well.

Like take it a month.

Yeah.

What?

I guess, let me guess.

It's doing pretty well.

Yeah.

It's doing good.

And so that's like another one.

I don't know if that's that big of a market, but what else is there?

I think it is a huge market.

I mean, look at what Ro and Hems did, right?

So they took erectile dysfunction and they've wrapped a brand that you won't feel embarrassed

your, you know, um, like associated with around it, right?

Like the value of Hems is not, is partially the telemedicine piece, which is like, you

don't have to go to a doctor and talk to somebody face to face about this.

So it's like reduces shame on one end.

And on the other end, it reduces shame.

The other way, which is you get the package, uh, there's no label on it.

It's like completely discreet.

And secondly, like they made their brand cooler so that you don't feel like a schmuck for

you, you don't feel like something's wrong with you or you're broken in some way for

using them.

Right?

Like that's like the value of their brand.

And that's why they built literally a billion dollar brand doing that.

Yeah.

Here's another one.

Have you ever, have you ever like cheese grated your foot to get the callas off?

You know, like, that's the most country thing you've ever said.

No, I have never done that.

I know what you're talking about, like, I've seen, I've seen a girl doing this on the,

like there's like a, like they equivalent of like a sweet potato peeler or whatever.

And they just like use that on their like to get their callas off their foot.

Yeah.

So I just sent it to you in the chat box.

It's, uh, it's basically, I bought one the other day because I had just like calluses

on my foot and it's basically just a cheese grater, like a, like a for parmigiano cheese.

They just call it a foot, a colossal foot wrap, a foot file, what they call it.

It's got almost a hundred thousand reviews.

Oh my God.

This thing has 82,000 reviews on Amazon.

It's just a cheese grater that they just have you ever seen a product with more reviews

than that?

Like the hot pot has the, it's the pot or whatever it has that many reviews.

Is that crazy?

It's a $10 like made in China cheese grater that they just call a foot file, is that insane?

That's insane.

Uh, that probably cost them 50 cents, right?

No, more than that.

But like, yeah, it's still profitable.

That's crazy.

Cause they're just going to get somebody's searches, right?

Like for something like this, um, the other one that's like the height one that I saw.

So somebody's doing this on Tik Tok and the ad is brilliant.

So they're selling a shoe, like a men's platform shoe.

So it's an insert into a normal shoe that's kind of like a heel, but instead of the heel

being on the outside of the shoe, it's on the inside.

So your foot, just like your heel gets elevated from the inside, like a doctor's shoals, but

like gives you two and a half inches and inside of a shoe, just do that way better.

Right.

And so how do they sell this?

How do they sell this?

The Tik Tok ad is it looks like, um, so it's, you know, this like, I don't know if you've

heard this thing in college, like a man on the street interview where it's basically

like, if you ever watch those late night shows, they'll go to like time square.

They'll be like, uh, you know, do you support, you know, whatever this thing?

And then people don't even know what it is.

They like say stupid stuff.

Well, it's basically like dude walking around with a microphone out and about like time square

or outside of a nightclub or like at a bar and they just like ask questions.

And so the ad is a Tik Tok is on Tik Tok and the, what the guy's doing is, are the girl

is, um, oh no, the guy's interviewing girls, he's like, all right, be honest, the size

matter when it comes to height for guys, right, or like something like that, they like immediately

get you of like, okay, first, this doesn't look like an ad.

Secondly, you kind of want to know what the girl says and then exactly cause it's preying

on an insecurity.

And so then, and it just quickly cuts between the girls and they'll be like, and it ranges

from a girl being like, uh, like, no, okay, yeah.

And then like, it's kind of like her admitting it.

And then it's like the next one is like two girls that be like, hell yeah, she won't even

date a guy if he's not six, five, and she's like, no, no, she's like, no, tell the truth.

It's true.

And like, and it's kind of like preying on the guy's insecurity like, oh man, girls

really care about this.

They won't admit it, but they, but if you get them to be honest, they really do care

that, that extra height matters, it'll be like, what's the perfect height for a guy?

And then they'll be like, um, six, one, like, you know, the average guy is my five, nine,

and they're like, yeah.

And then they're just laughing, right?

And it's like four of those cuts of like that interview.

And then it's like, um, and then, and then they do an even better version of it.

They're like, I've seen one, I think that's like the guys wearing it and they're like,

did you know that he's wearing this thing right now?

And they're like, no, I had no idea.

And it's basically like, people can't tell that you're wearing these things.

And so they're addressing the objections that somebody would have.

So first they create the demand, which is that like, girls will find you more attractive

if you're, if you're taller, then they address the objections, which is you don't look goofy

for wearing stilts and like, and so they're like, Oh, I have no idea.

No, you can't tell.

Oh my God.

That's awesome.

Like that's so clever.

And so they're like, and they supercut that together.

And I saw that and I was like, man, this is a really effective like marketing campaign.

And it's also an interesting product category that I wouldn't have otherwise really thought

about.

That's actually interesting.

Yeah.

This is pretty cool.

I never, that is a good one that people are embarrassed about.

They need to do an ad about how like everyone who says they're five, 11 is really just five,

nine.

Cause no one's actually five, 11.

Yeah.

If you do a man on the street, you're like, how tall are you?

They're like, yeah, five, five, 11, I'm six, I'm six.

And they're like, okay, cool.

We have a thing right here.

Just stand up.

And they're like, five, 10.

I know it's six even.

No, it's five, 11.

Are you six foot?

Yeah.

That's true.

Never, never met a six footer in your life.

It's like a leap year.

Six footer in my life dog.

You five 10.

Just admit it.

Five, 10, six, one.

None in between.

God skipped that.

We went from five, 11 to six, one, but you, but you ate six even.

God doesn't make mistakes, but he never made a man six foot even.

That stamp wasn't made.

So like anybody who says they're six even, that ain't true.

That's why I'm, I'm gonna always say at least six one.

I'm going to tell you another TikTok marketing thing that I think is pretty clever that

I saw.

Um, have you ever heard of it's probably, probably not.

It's pretty, pretty niche.

But this thing called Farcate apartments, uh, I have it on here, it's F-A-R-K-A-T-K-T-E.

So basically there's a woman on, on TikTok and she's a real estate broker or a leasing

broker and I'll tell you how I arrived at this.

So somebody had tweeted out something which was like, Hey, if you needed a side hustle

that was going to generate like three K to five K a month.

Um, and you could only kind of work like, you know, let's say like, you know, a couple

hours and during the week and, and, and you know, a half a day on the weekends or something

like that.

What would you do to do that if you didn't know how to code?

And one of the interesting answers was, Oh, I'd be a leasing agent because if you can

get an apartment leased up, you get, I think the first month's rent or something like that

as the broker.

And so the rent is going to be, you know, in New York or San Francisco, these big cities

rents going to be like three grand, four grand, five grand, six grand.

And so if you just lease one apartment, right?

And so if you get one apartment leased, you know, that's five K right there.

That's pure profit, essentially.

And what I saw was that some people, what they're doing is they're creating popular

TikTok accounts, just showing unique spaces or like in this case, she chose like hilariously,

I think hilariously bad apartments.

Like she'll walk into this place should be like, all right, this, this apartment, this

condo is a exquisite and like whatever, you know, Queens here.

And then she'll be like, you know, how many bedrooms is it?

There's no bedrooms.

There's just this loft.

Actually, it's not a loft.

Actually, it's just this like area above the kitchen where there's like a pipe above

your head, but like there's like three inches to go sleep up there if you can climb up.

And like, oh, you know, do you like the soothing sounds of water?

Well, the toilet keeps running.

So you'll have that Zen vibe.

And so she's like kind of making fun of like how overpriced apartments in New York are.

And for like how, how little you get for how much you pay, which is just a great viral

hook, right?

And she's just doing the literal thing, which is go to find an apartment, be like, Hey guys,

here's a great apartment.

She's finds hilariously bad deals, makes that her tick tock or really good deals.

And then she basically says, if you want an apartment, come to me.

And so I don't know if this is exactly her model, but because I just looked at it real

quick.

But like, I think that would be a model that would work is create content like we've seen

this on Instagram.

There's an account called Zillogun wild, which is hilarious to watch, which is like, it's

just like crazy ass homes from Zillogun.

And so you can kind of make like house porn or like apartment porn, where it's like just

really interesting stuff, like really interesting apartments or really interesting homes, really

overpriced, really underpriced, whatever.

And then use that as your lead gen for like, by the way, do you actually just want a two

bedroom apartment?

Like come through, like get it through me.

Like here's my listings, like you can actually see if you want like something that's not

like overpriced, here's my listings.

And like, I think just doing something like that, you could have, have a lot of fun and

build a pretty like solid business.

I mean, I'm sure she's going way more than 5k a month, but I just thought that was going

to be interesting, a little model.

I looked up, I looked up this word, I've never heard of that word.

It's a, I looked it up.

It's a Yiddish word that means poor quality.

And so, but who's this lady?

What's her handle?

It's just that it's that word.

Those were some of the Farkhakti apartments.

And that's her TikTok.

She has 37,000 followers and like, you know, like, here's a huge loft in Brunswick and

I have 108,000 views on that video, right?

So she's showing these things, but then she has her actual, she, so she's like comedy

actress slash realtor.

If you want my real rentals, you know, compass.com, go, go get them, right?

Like crushes.

Yeah.

So I thought this was great.

And it's like completely differentiated from what most people do.

And so like, I'm trying this right now with the milk road, which is like, I'm really obsessed

with this idea of like, you, if you combine two things that are usually not combined,

you don't have to be great at either one of the things because you've created a whole

new combination.

Right?

Like this happens in food all the time.

Or like you've, you've talked about this formula in food, like jumbo donut.

It's like, you don't need to have the best donuts, just do a huge donut and then people

will come to you for, for that, right?

Go for the biggest.

Make a green, you know, purple ketchup, green, like, you know, Dorito taco.

That's right.

Like, it's not that it's better.

It's just so different.

And so with milk road, we're doing this right now where I'm trying to create like basically

a, it's not funny enough or it just be like a straight up like comedy thing.

I don't like this podcast.

A lot of.

Yeah.

It's like this part.

Yeah.

I don't know why I'm trying to go for this like far fetched example.

This podcast, are we the richest?

No.

Are we the smartest?

No.

Are we the best prepared?

No.

Do we have the best insights and research?

Absolutely not.

Are we the funniest?

No.

We have the right combination of like, we were having a good time.

We make ourselves laugh and make you laugh just enough where like it's business and it's

just enough business and just enough make you laugh.

And that's what, like, I'm trying that with the milk road now.

I'm trying to do the same thing.

It's like, there's crypto information.

There's a lot of people trying to be the smartest guy in the room with crypto.

It's like a, a big brains contest.

You go into a room and everybody's just trying to have this like 9,000 IQ and it's like, well,

we want to be smart, but we're not going to be the smartest because who the fuck knows

who's the smartest?

It's really hard.

It's like, we can also be slightly funny and we would differentiate ourselves from everybody

else doing crypto content.

And so I'm pretty interested in this like, this like idea of stacking skill, unique skills

that are like, you don't have to be the best at either.

You just have to be just dangerous enough at both.

But if you combine them, you're completely differentiated in your market.

Can I ask you about a crypto story really quick that you, you might know about?

And I need you to explain it to me.

So do you know anything about Sam Bankman Freed that this is named, right?

Yeah, of course.

So how old is he?

Is he under 30 still?

Uh, he's like 29, 30, 31.

I know, I know he was under 30 at once, but is he still, I should know they are currently

the leading sponsor of the milk road.

So FTX, go get your, go get your account.

So he is 30 years old, exactly on the dot, on the dot, all right.

That was a bad joke.

I made by the way, I said, I knew he was under 30 once, but is he still under 30?

Uh, that's good.

Actually, I just didn't pick it up.

Um, all right, so this like, basically when he was 28, he was worth like $20 billion,

right?

Yeah.

He's the, I think he's probably, I think him or the guy from Binance, they're the richest

person from crypto besides whoever Satoshi is.

That's crazy.

So in this, he said in an article the other day, he's like, I'm thinking about spending

$100 million on the upcoming presidential election, but I'll probably cap out at about

a billion.

Yeah.

So just like that statement is just a ridiculous statement to like, not that it's wrong.

They're just like a crazy chain of words added together in one sentence.

Like I didn't think I would hear someone say it, let alone a 30 year old.

How, what type of person is this guy to become that rich at like 28?

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He also has a unique skill stack, which is that, so he was like, I think a trader or

an analyst at Jane Street.

So it's like kind of like a smart quant type guy.

And then, you know, I think I've told the story before, you know the story about the

kimchi, like arbitrage or whatever, you know, this?

Not exactly.

I know that like he did some arbitrage, but I don't understand why Bitcoin to be cheaper

in Korea than it would in America.

Well, it's all about like kind of like access and the liquidity of the market.

So like some markets, like for example, Japan is where the access was the hardest.

So like, I think, let's say this, for example, the government's cracked down on exchanges.

So you can only get it in the black market or on these small niche exchanges, these foreign

offshore exchanges.

There's a lot of friction.

And so because of that, you can't access Coinbase.com.

Yeah.

Like at a given time in Japan, you couldn't access, you couldn't easily buy Bitcoin.

Because of that, to buy Bitcoin in Japan, you were paying a premium.

So in theory, you could, let's say Bitcoin is priced at 30 grand.

You could buy Bitcoin for 30 grand in America.

And if you had a way to sell it in Japan, you could sell it for 32,000 and you could

just infinitely make a $2,000 spread.

And so it's kind of like, great, how much capital you got, pour it all into Bitcoin

in the U.S. and then sell it all instantly in Japan and you're not really taking much

risk because you're just quickly flipping it for that premium.

And so a lot of people were trying to do this.

Because I think there was a spread of about five grand in Japan or something like that

at the time.

But nobody knew how, like, it wasn't easy to go sell the thing in Japan.

Again, if it was that easy, there wouldn't have been the premium in the first place.

What he found was that I think it was in Korea that he, there was a smaller premium, but

it was easier to get around.

And so like what they did was they literally flew to Korea or whatever and they talked

to local banks and they were like, hey, we would like to have an account that will allow

us to wire money in significant size every day in and out.

Can you support that?

Can you support that action?

Because I'm going to basically be transferring in like, you know, call it $2 million in and

$2 million out the same day and it has to be the same day.

Just calling that action makes it sound cooler.

Can you support that action?

That's such a better word than...

Can you handle that size?

That's my new ship also, by the way, just being like, yeah, we got to be able to do it

in size.

Or like, yeah, they're moving in size.

I'm just going to say action instead of the word amount.

So like asking my wife how much beef she wants me to buy at the store, how much action you

want.

How much action you trying to get on these ribs?

In terms of oat milk, are we trying to move size?

How much action you want?

Yeah.

Crazy.

Oh my God.

So basically what ended up happening was he had this company, like whatever, Alameda Research

or whatever.

But like he saw that the, I think it was like the kimchi premium was like the big premium

was like, if Bitcoin was 10K in the US, it was 15K in Korea.

And I think in Japan, there was a smaller one.

And so he was able to do it in Japan and he made like something like $20 million doing

this arbitrage in like one summer.

And it took him like flying there, finding a network of local banks that would let him

wire serious money in and out and make sure that they could just repeat these transactions

on the same day clothes so that they had the money, they were recycling a small amount

of money.

So I think it was like, take $2 million, they buy Bitcoin, they sell it in Japan, they take

the money that they made in Japan, they need to be able to wire it back so that tomorrow

they can go buy again 2.2 million of Bitcoin based off of the extra that they made.

And then they did the same thing next day, 2.4 million.

And they got it up where they eventually profited like 20, 30 million.

So then he basically is like, all right, him and his like small team, I guess, like this

little crew that was doing this arbitrage.

Did he have money ahead of time or was he just like a like living with roommates?

Living with roommates.

Even now he lives like he drives like a old beat up Honda or some shit like that.

He sleeps like in the office on a giant bean bag.

So there's like tons of pictures of him just like passed out on a bean bag in front of

his desk.

And it's like, it's actually like two bean bags, like upper body on one feet on the other

creates this tiny little SBF bridge between them.

And like, that's just the way this guy works.

And he's like, you know, he's vegan.

He he's a he's like he practices this thing called effective altruism, I think is what

you call it.

And so so that's his thing, which is like his goal is like this philosophy and the goal

is make as much money as you can so that you can give away as much money as you can.

Like that's the point of making money is to give it away in the most effective manner

possible.

And so it's like earned to give is the like name of the is the name of the of the like

the philosophy of what they do is one of the things he's trying to do is like, yeah, that's

what he says he's motivated by.

So he's like, you know, he's donated like I think he donated like he's donated 200 million

already of his like net worth.

And he's and he's, you know, this thing about like I'm willing to donate up to a billion

dollars, you know, in the next one is to like, you know, another way to make change and it's

not all political.

Like it's like, where does the dollar have, you know, the most effect and that sort of

thing?

Yeah.

He did I also read an interview or is it you told me where he was like, I don't even

care about Bitcoin.

Like I'm just doing this to make money.

Like he said something to the he's he's not like it particularly like yeah, so there's

a lot of people crypto that are like very missionary.

Like if you listen to Brian Armstrong from Coinbase, he's like, he like lived in Buenos

Aires and he saw like, you know, what happened to the Argentinian peso and he was like,

it's not right.

Like people around the world are, you know, don't have access to like economic freedom

and you know, they live in a place where their currency gets devalued like crazy and like

there's a better way and it's crypto.

I believe that to my core and I'm going to like Coinbase is going to help more people

like get into crypto because I think crypto is what matters in the world.

And Sam Baker Freed is just sort of like, you know, not that his mission is different.

His mission is like, I'm an effective altruist.

I'm trying to give away as much money as possible so I need to make as much money as possible.

And in order to do that, I'm going to just, oh, you know, whether you're selling this

or that like, cool, people wanted an effective trading platform for crypto.

I'll build that.

You know, I know this product and this need because I'm a trader.

So I'll be able to like do it that way.

That's baller, man.

And there was a meme of him.

The other piece of the, I was going to say, the other piece of the effective altruism

is like, they really use like, they want it to be evidence based that like, you know,

every dollar going in is like having like, you know, sort of like the greatest possible

impact is like one of their, their big things like how measurable is the impact.

Dude, this guy's great.

There was a funny meme of him going around basically this guy, his name's Sam Bankman

Freed Google him and he looks like you'd want him to look.

So he's kind of like a chubby Jewish guy who wears like new balance shoes and like high

socks and cargo shorts and like an army green t-shirt and like shaggy hair and a huge Timex

watch.

Like, it looks like a watch to look.

Yeah.

And he, there's a picture of him on stage and it's like this beautiful interviewer.

And then on his left is like Giselle and on the right is like some other model.

Like how do you clip?

How do you get like these like, you know, smart, like business women who, but who are

just like the most gorgeous people you've ever seen and he's sitting in the middle and

they're all like looking at him and it's like, get you, get you a person who will look at

Sam Bankman Freed like Giselle looks at him or something like that.

And it's hilarious.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And he's just kind of hunched over oblivious to the whole thing.

It's great.

Is he like, what makes him special?

You know, that's hard to say, I haven't met him.

We've met some of the other like kind of people, the FTX team, like for example, their head

of strategy is like 25 years old or something like that.

It might be 24 and he's like the head of strategy there.

He like started off in customer service and is now the head of strategy.

And so I think they just like, if I could just kind of comment on like what you see

as the culture for them is like, they go hard.

What I mean by that is like, they're like, they're really sharp.

They're like kind of like quants and then they like work like, it just seems like they

work very hard and they move as fast as crypto moves, which is very, very fast.

And they didn't like, there was no like invisible walls for them.

Like the company is based in the Bahamas.

They grew like crazy when they wanted to do marketing.

They're like, okay, go get Steph Curry and Tom Brady and like, you know, Larry David

and that's who's going to be our spokesperson or whatever.

Like they like pulled no expenses.

They named, they like bought arena like he called somebody.

I know the guy who, we met the guy who did the athlete rights for them.

And basically he was like, yeah, he got, we got on a call and I was like, okay, so like

what are your goals with like, you know, sports sponsorships to help, you know, FTX, how

are you going to measure this?

He goes, how much does it cost to have the Yankees stadium renamed to FTX stadium?

It's like, yeah, I don't think that's even like for sale.

He's like, okay, what about every ad inside the stadium?

And he's like, that's a lot, man.

Like maybe we should just like kind of like crawl before we walk in, before we run.

And he's like, I think it would be most effective if we go get Tom Brady and Steph Curry and

Yankees, like you go do that and then tell me when you have them.

You know, like that was essentially the call and it was like, you know, name your price

and like that's what they did.

And guess what?

They got all of them.

And it's like a pretty impressive strategy where it's like, there's not like any, like,

you know, tiptoeing around in, in this.

I love those people.

I call them freaks and I love them.

I love these freaks.

I love freaks.

He also was one of my favorite Twitter followers.

Like, I don't know if you follow him on Twitter.

He posts awesome threads that are like not like, again, it's not propaganda for his company,

but it actually is effectively propaganda for the company.

So he'll just be like, you know, here's my thoughts on like raising money.

Here's what actually happens.

And he'll be like, investors, they want us to do this.

And at first I thought, that's just self-serving bullshit.

But then I realized actually the game theory is this and then he just talks, he'll just

lay out these long threads and like, he's like, look, I'm not saying this is FTX's point

of view.

This is like my late night thoughts about this topic.

And when you see him think out loud, you're like, oh, wow, this guy's just incredibly

sharp and he sees both sides of it.

He's kind of like an independent thinker.

And so he's one of the best follows on Twitter.

Do you think working with him, do you think that he's, he's obviously has some intensity

but is he like a hustle, hustle, like let's work like, why, like this alpha type of guy?

No, I don't get that vibe.

I don't get Wolf of Wall Street.

I don't get the, he's not, Genghis Khan took over 30% of the thing.

It's like, it's more like obsession meets like, you know, we don't, I don't know if

this got cut.

I think it's got cut out of our previous podcast where we were like, we kind of admire the

like Asperger's personality because it has like the ability to like focus really intensely

and the ability to like think, not like think for yourself and not think just like, oh,

what is the norm?

What's the societal norms?

Like, let me just go with that.

So to me, it's like, when he says that let's go get the Yankees and Tom Brady, it's not

because like, let's go swing our big D around here and let's go show who's boss.

It's like, well, it seems like the most effective thing to do if we're trying to build trust

would be go to the most trusted athletes and like get them and on a cost, you know, a cost

per, you know, fan basis, they're actually the most effective even though the total gross

dollar amount is higher.

But like, to me, that's how his brain works, not like, you know, it'd be sweet, dude.

If we go get like, let's go get the fucking Yankees, bro.

Like it's not that.

And so.

And he's like, he's like, uh, like, what's at the largest reach?

Okay.

That makes sense.

Yeah.

Just whatever's number one on that chart.

Just do that.

Right.

Exactly.

Like, well, if this has the arbitrage, then like, let's put all of our money into it

and like, let's hedge it over here.

Like that.

It's more like that.

And so.

And so I think that when they, in the same way that the intensity of the company is high,

but I don't think it's because it's like, bro, we got to grind if we want to make it,

you know, like, you know, uh, oh, you take weekends off, you know, you're soft, you know,

like it's not that it's more like, oh, I haven't eaten in 36 hours because I've just been like

really interested in this problem.

And I'm staring at my screen and I forgot to eat and I forgot to shower.

And I also, I guess I'll just sleep on this bean bag because that way I don't need to

commute because commuting waste, at least, you know, an hour a day and like, why would

I waste an hour of my day?

Like, you know, I'm just, I could sleep on this bean bag.

In fact, it's ergonomic or whatever, you know, like, I think that's more how the brain works

where it's like this hyper rationalism is what I would call it.

Do I wonder what he's like as a CEO?

Like you think he holds one-on-one meetings and like, because he just does not look like

well, we should have him in the head of whatever they wanted to come on the pod.

So I think they're, I think they're protecting him a little bit.

Like he's now super busy with like press obligations or whatever.

Like, so they, I think they were trying to have like their, the number two guy in the

company come on the pod.

And so this guy, Brett, so I think he'd be really interesting too.

But I, you know, everybody wants SPF because he looks, he's the Zuckerberg, right?

Like Cheryl might be the secret weapon and the one who actually runs the show, but like

Zuck is this like alien character that people are fascinated with and they want to like

poke them and be like, oh, look, it moves, you know?

And so I would love to get Sam on.

I wouldn't mind having a guy who is his boss, you know, a guy who works for him.

As long as the guy coming on would be cool.

We're only going to ask you about Sam.

Is that cool?

Yeah.

Like, oh, you know, I don't think you understand the assignment.

We don't care about like you.

That's not annoying, right?

Yeah.

Dude, it's like, if I meet someone who's like, oh man, love the podcast, I'm like, dude,

great.

So glad to meet a fan.

He's like, Sam's so awesome, what's it like to be around Sam?

Oh, fuck you, dude.

I'm busy.

Like, I'm like, I'm talking about Sam.

Well, we had a couple of guests and they're like cool and they like say, like, oh, yeah,

I worked with Steve Jobs and like, wait, wait, wait, all right, let's just, let's just only

focus.

Scrap your current thing.

So as long as they're okay, like if they understand the assignment that it's strictly

a like, we're just here to like learn, like Joe Rogan had this guy who worked at.

Space X and they talked about what it's like to work to Elon for Elon.

And I was like, oh, just let's just only focus on that thing.

The old go to space stuff is cool, but just tell me what it's like to work with Elon.

And that's what we, as long as they understand that the assignment, I'm on board.

The here's another kind of like interesting, like intensity team work thing that I think

is, you know, close enough transition.

Have you seen this business called a team?

I think it's just a letter A.

And then dot team is their website.

Well, you know, that's like a famous TV show, right?

You remember, uh, Mr. T, Mr. T or whatever.

Yeah.

Yeah.

All I know is that much.

I don't, I've never seen anything.

So, so it's that same.

Oh, like, I think they're kind of playing all that branding a little bit in the sense

that like, uh, the idea is based, so they just raised $60 million and they raised it

from NFX, who I really, NFX was early in them and said good things.

I, I respect that effect.

So made me pay attention.

Now this is an idea that's been around.

It's been tried, but maybe the time is right now.

And so that's why this is interesting to me.

So let me kind of give you my backstory of this idea and I want to hear what you think,

if you think this is a good idea or a bad idea.

So I once heard Naval on a podcast talk about like the future of work and he, he was basically

like, Naval was like, you know, I, um, I don't buy this whole, I don't believe that we're

going to live in a world where you work nine to five sitting in a desk in some office for

one company and you work there for 30 years.

And already you see that shifting, like instead of working at a place for 30 years, then getting

your pension when you retire and they like, you know, have a cake cutting ceremony in

the, in the lobby for you as they send you off to your death, like, okay, now people

started to hop jobs more and then people started to work, you know, remote and freelance.

And the ballast thing was like, he said, I think the future of work is like oceans 11.

He goes, you're going to have your crew the same way that oceans 11 is this badass team

of like, you know, you got the pickpocket guy.

You got the ninja.

You have the like the comms guy.

You have the planner.

You have the like, um, you know, the guy who can go gather Intel, you have the hot girl

who's the distraction and you have this, you know, you got Brad Pitt, George Clooney.

All right.

So that's the team.

And it's like, you're just going to get a message which says, all right, guys, round

up, like we got one, we got a mission to go on and everybody meets up and everybody's

doing other stuff.

And it's like, what's the mission?

Oh, like, you know, oceans 11, so we're going to rob this bank or whatever.

And then for, um, for work, it's going to be like, all right, here's this brand that's

trying to, whatever, they're killing the US, they're trying to expand into India.

And so you might be the oceans 11 team that continuously gets called on to take a brand

and expand them into India.

And like you, you wake up, you get a page, uh, you know, your pager basically goes off

and says, we need you.

The bat signal is up.

You all congregate.

You've all worked together.

So, you know, you come as a group who's good at accomplishing certain types of missions.

You do those missions.

You rate each other.

You rate the company that hired you.

They rate you.

You rate each other on your team.

You go on your way and you get called in for the next mission.

And the money hits your bank.

And so, Neval kind of describes this thing and he's like, you won't just have one team.

Like you'll probably float around with a couple teams.

Like if you're the pickpocket, you've got like three teams that can call on you.

And, um, and it just works that way.

So you get reputation that's built not on a resume, but through this like verified ratings

of like, I've actually worked with this person.

You have, um, not continuous work.

You get called on when there's a mission, you sprint, you crush it, then you relax until

the next mission.

You can work as much or as little as you want.

You may or may not even know the identities of the other people.

You could be like, my name is, my nickname is just whatever, Star Wing.

And I just go in and people know me as Star Wing and I just, that's how I work.

And like, that's the future of work.

So that kind of fascinated me when he, he described it and he did it in the Neval way,

which was like, you know, one 10th of the words I just used, but twice as interesting.

And now I'm starting to see some startups pop up that are doing this.

And to me, a team is, is an idea of that where they're like, oh, you want to build, um, an

e-commerce website?

Well we have the designer, the front end developer, the back end developer and the like conversion

optimum optimizer.

And like, they'll just swoop in and they'll just do it for you in like two weeks.

You'll get a better product than whatever.

And here's the big lump sum payment you do for that team.

This is so amazing.

I saw a meme the other day where it was a guy, he goes, I, I so look forward to the day where

I'm just sitting at a bar and a stranger walks up and says, I'm putting together a team and

I look at them and respond, I'm in, when do we leave?

And it was just like, yeah, I live in the double bag, you know, I put together, I put

the team together.

You win.

Uh, dude, this is awesome.

Their site is amazing.

This is one of the best landing pages I've seen in a long time.

It's a dot team.

Look at the landing page.

It's pretty good.

The hero image is really good.

And then, um, yeah, they just succinctly describe what they're doing.

So you just get on, you just log on and you see it's a relatively strange concept and

they describe it in like two sentences wonderfully.

This is awesome.

I'm not sure.

I don't, I think it's quite bold to say it's the future of work.

I don't think that that's what it is, but I think it's like a subset of freelancing.

That's going to be amazing.

Yeah, exactly.

That's not everybody, but in the same way like the gig economy made it so that, you

know, I can like a thing that didn't happen 10 years ago or whatever like was you wake

up, you like hop in your car, you open up your phone.

This guy wants to ride over here, drive over there, pick them up, drop them off, cash at

your bank.

You know, you made $16 for that ride.

Oh, you want to go, you want to stop working because you want to go pick up your daughter

from school.

You swipe to log off, you're off work now.

You want to get back on later, you know, at midnight and take people to the airport.

All right.

And like that whole gig economy thing where your phone just gives you jobs or it gives

you work that will just pay you small micro like payments off your micro tasks.

That's pretty cool.

And that's like a thing that Uber and like TaskRabbit and DoorDash all brought to the

table.

So I feel like there might be the next version of that, which is like for highly skilled cross

discipline.

Like I know I could do this, for example, like I have three or four people where it's

like that's the great developer.

This is the great designer.

I'll be the marketing guy and this guy will be the, you know, whatever them.

But the problem is is that they're not available like to do stuff and this is creating an opportunity

for them to be available.

But if like I've gone on, I've gone to the Shopify marketplace and I've used Upwork and

oftentimes when I use Upwork, it's just like a guy in India who's like the face and he's

got like a team of like eight guys and like, and that kind of what's already happening.

They just packaged this in a far more sophisticated and sexy way.

Yeah.

They did in a more sexy way and I think it's more for premium like things to like in the

same way that like, if you don't want the India thing, but you want like sort of like

what an agency does, but what typically what agencies do is they specify, they, they specialize

in one vertical.

So it's like, we do SEO, we do Facebook ads, we do copywriting.

And what this is saying is like, no, you're trying to launch a marketplace.

You're trying to launch a new NFT marketplace where you're going to need somebody who's

great at email marketing.

You're going to need an engineer who knows smart contracts.

You're going to need a designer.

You're going to need a social media person.

So like whatever, they give you the six cross disciplinary people that are good at building

marketplaces.

And that's just like a different cut of the same idea of agencies.

This is awesome.

This is one of the cooler companies I think I've seen lately.

This is amazing.

Yeah.

How'd you find this?

Uh, cause the guys I follow at NFX, they were like, Hey, this company's grown really

fast.

Like fast.

I forgot what they said, but it was like growing super fast and I was like, how fast?

And uh, you know, that's why I started looking to it and it reminded me of that, like that

dreamy idea that Neval had brought up and I was like, Oh, maybe now with COVID, maybe

now the time has changed where like there's enough really talented people that are no longer

like locked into jobs, um, because they've got like all, they've got like all the right

people.

If you go to like their team, it says that their, their featured advisors are the guy

who started Fiverr, which is crazy.

The guy who started Fiverr also started lemonade.

That's pretty wild.

The CEO of Upwork, so like they've got all the right people on board.

Wow.

Yeah.

This is an amazing company.

This is a badass.

Fine.

I've never, I'd never heard of these guys.

Yeah.

That's cool.

Um, all right.

Take another idea off this list and, uh, uh, another topic of this list and let's do

that.

Um, uh, let's do that one.

Uh, yeah.

I literally never read docuSign.

I just signed.

Uh, this is more like, I just needed to sign.

I need to verify with you.

Do you also do this?

Like, dude, when I get a docuSign, I'm not reading it.

I'm not going to lie.

You can scan me pretty easily.

Have you seen the South Park episode where like it's like what they do is, um, they create,

you know what a caterpillar is?

No.

So it's like, do I want to know the chain of six people and they sew their mouths to

the person's butt and you just got to stay there.

Okay.

So the apple does that to people because it says it in the terms and conditions in iTunes

when you sign up and the whole episode is like, whoa, Stan, you didn't read the terms

and conditions of apple before you click.

Yes.

That's crazy.

Of course.

Like you have to go do a caterpillar now because that's what it said.

I can't believe you didn't read it and it's like this whole thing, but, um, dude, I've

been getting docuSigns lately where they literally just send me the sign page and they don't even

send me.

Yeah.

Okay, here's the docuSigns, it's just a one underline and it says sign here.

I'm like, sign what?

Yeah.

It's called the signature package and basically I've got it in the context of a company that

I've invested in.

They need me to sign paperwork for some reason because they're raising a new out of new valuation

at a higher valuation and they literally just send me the signature packet and like I have

it's four or six things.

And I'm just, it just says like Sampar and then why I'm signing and I have no idea what

I'm signing.

And so, yeah, like, A, yes, I do that because I just don't read the stuff and B, sometimes

they don't even send me the stuff to read, they just send me, they just sign.

I have no idea what it means.

Do you get that?

Yeah.

I've been getting those and I'm like, I'm like, all right, it's one thing if I'm not

going to read it.

For you to not even write it, it's like a whole level, another level of arrogance here and

like, you know, poor form that we're taking out of here because of like lawyer at fu.com

and just sign this shmuck and just like sign this nerd and just sign this shmuck.

Law firms name, fuckman banks.

What is that?

What do those guys do?

Yeah.

Yeah.

You guys based in New York?

Yeah.

I didn't even see more butts asking me to sign this stuff, but they're just messing with

it.

Yeah.

That's crazy.

It's like, you know, when people really want to get us to respond, they're like Venmo-esque

money or they're like Paypal-esque money being like, oh, I'm being super creative to like,

to reach you, to get you to read my message or whatever, and I'm like, it doesn't really,

doesn't really work.

I don't really like that and it makes me feel uncomfortable and like, you know, generally

the people I want to meet never do that.

So I'm like, you know, generally this is not a good signal for you.

The other day, these guys were emailing me to try their stuff and they're like, what are

you, soft?

You're not up for the challenge.

And I just, I was just like, I am not up.

I am not up for the challenge and they just replied with, okay, I am not up for the challenge.

I think people, they hear us out here and we're joking around and they're like, ah,

what if I take that joke to the next level and I make it weird and they don't know me.

They somehow think that's going to work.

It's like, this works as me and Sam have known each other for like 10 years and the jokes

are meant to be jokes.

They're not serious.

It's like, then you take the, you take that same idea, you make it serious and you do

it from a stranger.

It's like, no, no, no.

It's not the same thing.

Yeah.

I actually don't like the annoying, the other day, this guy sent me an email and in the

subject line, it said like, you know, like you're a C word sucker and he's like, made

you open.

And I was like, oh, I don't, I don't like that, that I find that to be inappropriate

and not cool.

Like I'm not on board with that and that's what he said, but I can totally see how somebody

would listen to this podcast and think, ah, they'll love that.

Yeah.

Like, why are you approaching me?

It's like, we're, we're, that's what we're doing.

We're like, oh, I love this copywriting and you know, just do what you got to do.

And for the hustle, I was super annoying getting people to be conference speakers like, yeah,

but I don't like when it happens to me.

Yeah.

I didn't call someone like a little bitch.

Like people will call me that.

They're like, what's up you little bitch?

Like, dude, I don't know you.

Who was doing that?

Yeah.

Somebody was doing that.

Somebody who worked for us was doing that, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I have not called them out, but they called us a little bitch and I'm like, dude, you're

an intern.

Don't talk to me like that.

And like my friends don't even call me a little bitch.

Like, what are you talking like that for?

It was like, I think it was an intern that called us that.

Oh, I know.

I think it was a bray you.

A bray you used to call us a little bitch.

I wasn't going to call them out.

You're like, I'm not going to call them out unless it's a bray you in which case it was

a bray you.

He was our producer and he'd be like, time to work you little bitch or something.

Dude, don't talk to me like that.

I'm going to talk to you like that.

It's like, why are you calling me that?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Bray you came in really hot.

You came in really hot.

What's this?

Yeah.

No, I mean, I love him and he could talk to me that now that we're friends.

And that co-workers.

But when we were co-workers, I was like, dude, I was like offended.

I was like, please don't call me that.

I don't like that.

Zelinsky Deepfake.

What's that?

Oh, wait.

No.

What's the history of the year?

That's a longer one.

I went down this rabbit hole of like the history of the internet, like how it came out.

Pretty crazy.

Just crazy stuff.

I'm not going to do that one right now.

That one's too long.

But okay, so Zelinsky Deepfake, so people know about Deepfakes, which is like, I think

a lot of people who listen probably know about Deepfakes, but if you don't, it's basically

the way that you can Photoshop a picture to kind of like edit and make it look a certain

way.

And it looks real, but like, oh, no, that's been photoshopped.

You can now do that with video, which kind of means, it's not yet.

There are some, but like, you know, in a small way, like the Snapchat face filter is essentially

like a bit of a deepfake.

There's this.

Have you seen the baby one?

Or the one where it makes you sad and cry?

No.

Is that on Snapchat?

Yeah.

Or it's on Instagram.

I think they like show someone's face and they're like, hey, Sean, why are you so sad?

Why are you crying?

And you're like, what?

I'm not crying at all.

But like, it looks like you're crying and sad and like you will cry.

So like that's one version of it, then there's like this, there's this app, I forgot what

it's called.

It's moves or something like that.

It's like some dance app.

But like, you basically take a picture of yourself standing there and then it'll make

it look like your body, it'll make you look like a great dancer.

You're like, you could go post something on Twitter.

I think you might have done this where it's like, I think that's what you found it was

I did it.

It looked like I was breakdancing.

Yeah.

You're like breakdancing.

Yeah.

Just jamming out on a Wednesday.

It's like, whoa, Sam can breakdance.

Then it's like, well, it's not quite right.

Wait a minute.

And it's like, oh yeah, that's like a deepfake.

Basically, it's a deepfake video.

And so this, but they're getting better and better.

Like you'll see them do this with like, oh my God, did you hear Obama saying the N word?

It's like, what?

No.

And then you watch this video.

It's like, it's a deepfake, but they could like mimic his voice and his lips moving and

talking doing something.

And then this is happening.

It's like, it's becoming a big problem in the porn industry because people are doing

this with like, oh, there's some girl in my college and I'll just take her picture and

I'll make it look like she shot this sex tape or whatever and people like, dude, that's

like, you know, really effed up, but like the technology can do that.

Can do that now.

It can basically make it look like somebody was doing something that they never did.

And so this is becoming a problem.

And there's one with Zelinsky, the Ukrainian president and president, whatever he is.

And like, there's this video going around of him talking and it's a real video.

There's a real video.

And then there's the deepfake video where it shows like a trail powder of cocaine on

his desk and the Russian propagandists are saying like, look at this, your president's

breaking down.

He's using drugs.

That's why he's saying all this crazy stuff.

And they made it.

They added some stuff in the background of the video and I'm like, oh man, this is just

going to get super crazy of like, how do you know what you can trust?

If you can't trust your eyes and ears anymore, like, how are we going to like prosecute crimes?

How are we going to like prevent people from like just completely slandering your reputation?

How are we going to prevent people from like, you know, like this was what people said that

the Russians were doing with Hillary like during the election was like, they were showing

propaganda like Hillary said this about black people and they were promoting that in like

predominantly black counties where they were trying to sway the vote and get them to not

turn out for Hillary.

And it's like, it was fake, right?

But it was like misinformation.

And so to me, I'm like, this deepfake thing is going to be like a real, real problem.

And I think there's opportunity.

Well, there's one answer that a buddy was trying to work on, which was basically a way to like

certify the off like the original mint of the video.

So it's like, you can basically encrypt the original video so that if anybody wants to

see like, oh, this video of this guy saying this crazy thing, is this, was this what was

originally shot from the phone?

And so he was trying to do that.

But really what you need is you need the phone makers to participate because it has to be

done at like the hardware level because anything else it can be tampered with.

It's like, well, if it's just a video file, I encrypt, then I could just like encrypt it

later.

I could edit it first, then encrypt it.

So it has to be done like as it's being shot, the apple and Google and Samsung or whoever

these people are, they're going to have to bake it in where like every video comes with

a seal of authenticity and then that's going to be a cat and mouse game of like, can that

be faked?

Because you could put somebody in prison for like a fake murder, you know, like, that's

how crazy this is going to get if we don't have a way to fight against deepfakes.

By the way, go to the chat of Riverside and click the link I just sent you.

Tell me what you think about that deepfake.

Oh, that's you dancing.

Dude, that's great.

Yeah.

He said announcement.

Well, while you guys have been taking this time to chill, your boys have been learning

to dance and get on my level.

And it's a video of you.

Okay.

So it's get it.

Get sway.

So sway is the name of the app.

So get sway.app is the name of the thing.

It's hilarious.

Although it made you a little look a little chunky here.

You look a little bit like Will Ferrell in this video.

So, you know, well, yeah, you could dance, but it also looks like you put on like the

COVID 30.

I was that was pretty influencer.

Well, but it's like glitching.

It's like, it's like, it's not the it's not your actual thing.

It's like, because you're moving so fast, it's like, it has to make it fuzzy.

It can't have like a really sharp like line.

It's pretty good.

It's obvious.

It's pretty good.

Click left.

Go to the left one.

I mean, it's pretty amazing for it's, it's a pretty amazing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Anyway, I hope some smart people out there are working on deep fakes.

I'm curious what people are going to do.

The only solution I know is doing it at the hardware, the operating system level.

And even that's probably not perfect.

But if somebody does figure out a perfect way to do this, that's going to be very, very

valuable technology.

And I saw the Obama thing.

Yeah, they made them kind of say some crazy shit.

Yeah, man, I agree.

It is kind of scary.

Well, Ben, what do you think?

How do we do?

We got a great episode.

Very eclectic.

No real unifying theme, but like all very interesting stuff.

And, and the cola stuff was, was all time.

Can't, can't wait to drink a cola with you guys.

What was your favorite one?

Your favorite non-colla, doing the cola one, which one's you like?

I think eaten caramels is my favorite.

It's just simple and amazing.

It's all unexpected.

I think my favorite was actually, we were just eating spaghetti, kissing in the middle

all of a sudden.

Me and my co-founder were doing the kissing, the spaghetti thing where you each take one

and put it in your mouth, get me in the middle.

And what we realized was that the recession.

Yeah.

And then we realized, yeah, that's a good one.

But the thing is, like, but the thing about co-founders is, it's like, you don't address

the first part.

And you got to do this like in a keynote, it's like a product, like a sleep job product

announcement.

Right.

And never address it and never lie.

We just look in the office, grabbing each other's butts, and then it hit us.

Why stop there?

You know?

All right.

We're out of here.

Cheers.

I feel like I can rule the world, I know I could be what I want to.

Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.

Shaan Puri (@ShaanVP) and Sam Parr (@TheSamParr) talk about how the future of work will look like an Ocean's 11 team, height enhancing surgery, Sam Bankman-Fried, and how to solve the problem of deepfakes.
-----
Links:
* My Body Tutor
* SiriusXM Acquires Conan O'Brien's Team Coco podcast
* Moiz's tweet
* Surgery that makes men taller
* Foot file
* TikTok apartments
* Sam Bankman-Fried
* A.Team
* GetSway app
* Do you love MFM and want to see Sam and Shaan's smiling faces? Subscribe to our Youtube channel.
* Want more insights like MFM? Check out Shaan's newsletter.
-----
Show Notes:
(01:25) - Shaan eating healthy & MyBodyTutor
(05:20) - How much MFM is worth?
(09:15) - Drinking Cola and Genghis Khan
(14:10) - Surgery to make you 3 inches taller
(25:15) - TikTok Apartments
(39:10) - Sam Bankman-Fried
(49:10) - A.Team
(55:10) - No one reads Docusign
(61:10) - Zelensky Deep Fakes
-----
Past guests on My First Million include Rob Dyrdek, Hasan Minhaj, Balaji Srinivasan, Jake Paul, Dr. Andrew Huberman, Gary Vee, Lance Armstrong, Sophia Amoruso, Ariel Helwani, Ramit Sethi, Stanley Druckenmiller, Peter Diamandis, Dharmesh Shah, Brian Halligan, Marc Lore, Jason Calacanis, Andrew Wilkinson, Julian Shapiro, Kat Cole, Codie Sanchez, Nader Al-Naji, Steph Smith, Trung Phan, Nick Huber, Anthony Pompliano, Ben Askren, Ramon Van Meer, Brianne Kimmel, Andrew Gazdecki, Scott Belsky, Moiz Ali, Dan Held, Elaine Zelby, Michael Saylor, Ryan Begelman, Jack Butcher, Reed Duchscher, Tai Lopez, Harley Finkelstein, Alexa von Tobel, Noah Kagan, Nick Bare, Greg Isenberg, James Altucher, Randy Hetrick and more.
-----
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• #209 Gary Vaynerchuk - Why NFTS Are the Future
• #178 Balaji Srinivasan - Balaji on How to Fix the Media, Cloud Cities & Crypto
#169 - How One Man Started 5, Billion Dollar Companies, Dan Gilbert's Empire, & Talking With Warren Buffett
• ​​​​#218 - Why You Should Take a Think Week Like Bill Gates
• Dave Portnoy vs The World, Extreme Body Monitoring, The Future of Apparel Retail, "How Much is Anthony Pompliano Worth?", and More
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