True Sunlight: MMP #83: Alex Murdaugh Verdict: How We Got to Guilty + Creighton Waters Interview

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I now know beyond a reasonable doubt that Elik Murdoch murdered his wife Maggie and his

son Paul after a Colletin County jury found him guilty on all four counts.

He was sentenced to life in prison and that is a big deal.

My name is Mandy Matney.

I have been covering the Murdoch family for four years now.

This is a very special episode of the Murdoch Murders Podcast.

MMP is produced by my husband David Moses and written by my best friend Liz Farrell.

So it happened.

We got to a real guilty verdict.

And this is a pivotal moment of this podcast.

But not at all the end.

While it was ultimately the public servants of South Carolina led by prosecutor Creighton

Waters who secured the guilty verdict, I just want to take a moment to thank those who believed

in us and encouraged us to keep going all of this time.

It's honestly amazing that we still have a podcast and it's especially amazing that

Elik Murdoch was found guilty of murder and will likely spend the rest of his life behind

bars.

The good guys won for once and we're now in a territory that we never really imagined

when we started in June 2021.

We could not have gotten to this point without our awesome team who I want to thank very

quickly.

Ali Pavlich and Jesse Garrett, our Video Partner Eric Allen and of course our Cup of Justice

Co-host Eric Bland, Neil Meredith, Shelby and Orin from UTA, Justin Bamberg, whose Birthday

was this week, the AdLarge Team, Greg Finch, Callie Lyons, Beth Braden and Sam Berlin on

our Research Team and a special shout out to Sam's Mom and huge MMP-Fan Caroline, who

also has a birthday this week.

To Deslombardo on our YouTube Team and all of the MMP Premium Members and over 2 million

Listeners for helping support our mission to expose the truth wherever it leads.

At this point all of you are very clear on just how big of a deal this guilty verdict

is to those of us who live in the low country.

A Murdoch was put on trial for murdering his family in Colleton County and the jury found

him guilty.

The unlikelihood of that conclusion, the unlikelihood that Alec Murdoch would be facing those charges

in the first place, cannot be understated.

If this were the good old boy days of Buster Murdoch, there would have been another man

standing at Alec's place to take the fall or there would have been no trial at all.

Maggie and Paul's deaths would have been forgotten, there would have been no justice

and that is the truth of it.

So this is a big day and we hope a new day in South Carolina.

We knew that he did this to Maggie and Paul.

This is exactly how the case needed to end.

But until we heard those 4 guilty verdicts read by the Colleton County Clerk of Court

Becky Hill, it wasn't an outcome that we could ever be certain about.

Over the past few days we've been reflecting on the magnitude of this case and what we hope

it will mean for the future of law enforcement and prosecution in our state.

More specifically, what it will mean for the future of other powerful people who break

the law and assume that they can pay their way out of this situation.

Until we are all held accountable to the same laws, regardless of our positions of influence,

our financial portfolios, our race, our age, our gender, our sexual orientation, our political

beliefs, there will be no justice in the justice system in our opinion.

This verdict is a huge step in the right direction.

We hope this outcome inspires those who work within the system and those of us who do not.

Those of us on the sidelines who need to call out injustice when we see it.

That said, the road to Ellic Murdoch being found guilty was not an easy one for anyone

to travel, starting with the night of the murders.

Here is Colletin County Sheriff's Deputy Chad McDowell about 17 minutes after he arrived

at Moselle.

Hearing that on body camera was a stark reminder of how it is down here, or at least how it

was in June 2021.

From the get go, the Murdoch name meant something to law enforcement.

It meant that whatever the scenario was, their ability to do their jobs would be affected

by this outside force, this undeniable influence in some way.

This undeniable influence required an army to defeat it.

So today we wanted to take a look at that army and all the elements that contributed to this

amazing outcome.

Let's start with the most important one.

This case required a prosecutorial team that could and would go the distance.

One that could withstand the political pressure from Dick Harpoolian and other powerful attorneys

in the state, including from PMPD itself.

One that wasn't tainted by its own connection to the Murdoch name.

When we talk about the corruption that the Murdoch name has long been associated with

in the 14th Circuit, we're talking about complex relationships, actions, and motivations

for those actions.

While there is no one method to this madness, it's these complex relationships that are

at the heart of the problem.

We have talked time and again about how the 14th Circuit Solicitor Duffy Stone didn't

recuse himself from the case until August 2021.

The date of Ellick's interview was sled, when Agent David Owen outright asked Ellick

if he had murdered Maggie and Paul.

I feel like we can say with a lot of confidence that had the South Carolina Attorney General's

office not taken over this case, we would not be talking about this guilty verdict today.

We needed that big Creighton energy, and that's what he gave us.

Prosecutor Creighton Waters didn't flinch, he didn't mince words, he didn't miss an

opportunity to remind the court just who Ellick Murdoch really was, right through to the very

end.

Here's Creighton, right before Judge Clifton Newman sentenced Ellick to two consecutive

life sentences.

And I've looked in his eyes, and he liked to stare me down as he would walk by me during

this trial.

And I could see the real Alex Murdoch when he looked at me.

The depravity, the callousness, the selfishness of these crimes are stunning, the lack of remorse

and the effortless way in which he lies, including here sitting right over there in this witness

stand.

Your Honor, a man like that, a man like this man, should never be allowed to be among

free law-abiding citizens again.

So there is a long list of people that we wanted to interview after the trial, but at the very

top was Prosecutor Creighton Waters, a man who put his everything into this case to secure

a guilty verdict for the state.

And we got him.

On Monday afternoon, we talked to Creighton Waters about the trial, the justice system

and the significant work he and his team put into this case.

We started by asking, what were the biggest moments for him during this trial?

Well, I think, you know, if I was going to kind of go in order, that very first day,

when those jurists start coming in, and all of a sudden, you know, you kind of realize

that this is real, and this is happening, and you know, you're at the edge of the bottom

of the mountain, and you know, it's going to be a long climb.

I just remember that first day, just kind of sinking in, as those jurists started to

file in, that, oh wow, I mean, we're about to do this thing, and it's going to be such

a long and hard fight, and it turned out to be even longer than we thought.

And I think by the time we got there, we realized it was going to be longer than three weeks,

but I didn't know it was going to go six.

As the, you know, the other big moment I remember was just getting that opening out of the way.

You know, once we had a jury selected, just doing that opening, you know, openings tend

to be pretty short, and that there was that storm on the way, and that was already kind

of a theme that I had been using, and it just seemed so, you know, perfect that that storm

was coming when I was talking about that storm that Alec was from Maggie and Paul.

And then, you know, going forward, it was just, it was such a, you know, the team, we

were kind of like, it was like dorm life again, you know, we were all living in this Hotel,

and we had one room that was our war room, just, that's all it was, and, you know, everybody's

working all night, and then getting up early and working, and working all day, and, you

know, just so many, just such an interesting experience there throughout the entire process.

And then, of course, I always thought Alec would testify, and to me, that was, you know,

that seemed to be a very crucial moment of the trial, and so that was, that was really

huge.

And, you know, I had a last series of questions that I was going to ask him on that cross and

having to wait for however many hours it was to kind of close with that.

And, you know, I remember that, that just, you know, being a big moment, and so those

were just some of them that come to mind when you asked that question.

We also talked about the moments when things did not go quite as expected.

Obviously, there, you know, Jim and Dick and, you know, are very good lawyers, and Phil

and Maggie, too.

And so, you know, we knew that was, that was going to be a fight, and that they were going

to make their points, they were going to have good cross, so, you know, this witness, so

that witness.

And, you know, you just have to keep, keep going, you know, it's, it can be in a trial

like that, you know, you outwardly have to be calm and, you know, never bothered, but

certainly there's times where, you know, the defenses, you know, making points or cross-examining

a witness, and, you know, your insides are just turning, but you got to just keep digging

in, and, and I hope that you can get your point cross at the end.

A few times in a couple of justice, we have talked about the prosecution and defenses,

though they were sports teams.

And we consider how far up the prosecution was, or how many points the defense scored

on a particular day.

We asked Creighton if they were doing that same thing.

No, I don't think that that's, that's how I looked at it, and I don't think that,

you know, I felt that way.

Obviously, during the state's case, you know, we're kind of building this, this, this narrative

and, you know, and, and of course we're kind of, you know, the defense makes their points

during cross, but we're, you know, we've kind of got the momentum during the state's

case.

And then the defense case happens, and then they start to do the same thing.

And so you can kind of feel it shift back the other way, and then, you know, you get

the rebuttal case, and you get, you know, the cross of Alec, and then closing, and you

feel it shifting back the other way.

You know, one thing I had the advantage of doing was looking those jurors in the eyes,

and, you know, and of course all the members of the team did, all the attorneys had a chance

to do that.

And, you know, you can kind of get a sense of, you know, if it's resonating or not.

But you know, you try not to overly think about that.

I mean, all you can do is present your case, and then it's going to be out of your hands.

And, you know, trial lawyers, I've said over and over again, we can be superstitious.

And, you know, you try not to dwell too much on that, because the evidence that you have

is the evidence you have.

You're going to present it regardless.

And so if you get yourself bogged down and to worry in too much about, you know, where's

the meter right now, you know, I think you can get off your game.

You just focus on getting at your evidence, and then, you know, bring it home in the end.

We talked about what it was like for Creighton and his team to try this case in front of a worldwide

audience, something none of them had experienced before.

Well, you know, there's obviously never had an experience like that.

And I don't know that any of us will again, you know, obviously there's still cases pending.

And this thing has a lot of heads to it.

And I can't comment specifically on anything pending.

But this was obviously the big one.

And, you know, the scene outside with all the media tents, all the people that showed up,

we had really great support from the public, a lot of smiles, the community was great.

So it was absolutely unique.

But again, to go back to the sports analogy, this is something else we talked about.

You know, I've heard players in the Super Bowl say that, you know, when they get ready

for the Super Bowl, there's a lot more nerves.

And, you know, there's so much more emphasis to that.

There's so much more media attention and all this other stuff going on.

But then when you get out there and you run your first play and make your first, you

know, tackle or catch or whatever it is, take your first hit, then it's just another game.

And that's what we try to do.

Obviously, we're not entirely immune to all of that.

It's completely different.

But again, the more we can normalize this as a trial, very complex and difficult trial,

just being a trial and sort of just focus on handling court as we would, you know, the

better we could.

Obviously, that's not entirely successful.

We, you know, there was just such a scene around there.

You know, I remember first arriving on Saturday and there was only one food truck out there

and it was like a Elephantier truck, like you say at the fair.

And I remember joking, I even joke, this is Judge Newman one, so why don't we just

go ahead and get a roller coaster and a Ferris wheel out here.

You know, but I will say this, everybody was really great.

So many people gave us encouragement.

So many members of the community, the people of the hotel were great.

We made friends with these folks and it was actually kind of, you know, feel a little

bit nostalgic when I was packing up my hotel room for the last time.

And in case you were wondering whether he knew that people were cheering him on by

calling him BCE, i.e. Big Crate and Energy, here's what he had to say about that.

Well, yeah, I know that there's some t-shirts out there and I've heard, I've been told,

Liz, that you're the one who kind of coined that term, yeah, you know, I think, yeah,

I've heard some of that and, you know, I started, I got, I did my first tweet ever on Saturday

and, you know, I obviously have seen that term used in some of the responses that people

have been sending and I think that Friday, you know, there were, there were some people

wearing that shirt and I went over and spoke to them and took a picture with them.

I figured I couldn't, I think I was doing an interview or something.

I couldn't just let them sit there and watch and not go over and speak to them.

So, but yeah, I guess I did the thing now because, you know, that trial was so exhausting

and I still, you know, I don't think, you know, I know I still haven't recovered yet

and ended up losing like 10 pounds, but, you know, having that term out there, you know,

you know, sometimes when you had to dig deep, you know, you realize that, you know, that

you had to give that energy, right?

And so that, you know, we tried to sustain that and again, you know, this was a big team

and it had to be a big team because not one of us could have survived if it was just

one or two of the warriors and a couple of staff members, you know.

We had to have a big team so that we all could have the energy to make it through that process

and, you know, everybody had their role, you saw them all in action, the staff members,

you know, don't get up and speak as much, but they are crucial, sometimes even more

crucial and, you know, I don't think any of us could have made it if we didn't have

every single member of that team that was there.

Creighton's Team was made up of investigators, prosecutors, paralegals, and other support

stuff.

In addition to the Attorney General himself, Allen Wilson, Sled, und Sled-Chef Marc Kiel,

along with other law enforcement agencies, it was this team that was crucial to getting

us to guilty and among the more experienced members of the team, there were a lot of

firsts, which was really cool to hear.

It was great to be in such high staan, a lot of things.

He has a lot of courtroom experience, but that was his first witness in front of a jury.

Carlson Burnie war unser Freund, er hat wahnsinnige Arbeit, wie ihr seht, und all das white-collar

alles.

Das ist wiederum noch Pending, und Alec hat uns in einem Fertig-Trial und ich werde

es klar sein.

Carlson testet und qualifiziert als Experte für das erste Mal.

Savannah hat einen tollen Job gemacht, mit einem wirklich schweren Kram.

Wir haben sogar mein Mentor in Boston, Alenka, da oben.

Und ich dachte, das war gut.

Es waren nur Momente für alle.

Meine Parallelgien und die Mitarbeiter waren mit mir.

Ich konnte nicht über Carly überleben.

Sie ist einfach total fantastisch.

Izzy ist mein Investigator.

Und nicht nur hat er mich all die Zeit folgen müssen, aber er hatte wirklich

gute Insights.

Und er hat wirklich einen tollen Insight.

Und David Fernandez ist mein richtigem Mann.

Und er hat wirklich einen tollen Kram.

Ich dachte auf Sutton, der Experte, among other things, in diesem Fall.

Und dann kann ich nicht aufs Sled gehen.

Ich meine, Sled.

Und ich werde aufs Sled gehen.

Und natürlich war das nicht ein Sled-Sled-Sled-Case.

Das ist das, was das Sled-Sled-Sled-Case ist.

Aber was das Sled-Sled-Sled-Sled-Case ist, ist das Partnerschaft

von der AG und Sled.

In den Fronten der Cases.

Und in diesem speziellen Fall mit den Mördern.

Wir hatten es nicht in September.

Aber im September 2021.

Aber wir haben das Experte zusammen mit unseren Partnern,

das ist ein Sled-Sled-Sled-Case.

Und ich will niemanden verlassen,

denn all diesen Agents haben so einen tollen Job.

Carlton County war toll.

Kenny Kenzie war toll.

Es war so ein Team-Effort.

Und jeder war in diesem Hotel.

Wir arbeiten, wie du es dir erwähnt,

12, 15 Uhr arbeiten.

Ich glaube, ich arbeite 21 Stunden lang.

Und jeder hat wirklich seinen Weg.

Aber es war viel Spaß.

Und ich glaube, ich habe noch etwas mehr zu tun.

Ich habe noch mehr zu tun als ich.

Und vielleicht habe ich noch ein paar Soda-Poppers.

Aber wir hatten eine gute Zeit.

Und es war wirklich schön,

wieder in der Schule zu gehen.

Und zu leben in Dorm-Leifen.

Und zu bleiben in Läden, Kramen.

Das ist einfach so.

Ja, und wir machen das, bevor ich losgeht.

Ich will niemanden verlassen.

Und ich bin nicht in Ordnung.

Daniel und Shane sind einfach awesome.

Und ich will nicht verlassen.

Und ich habe mich in meiner Karriere begonnen.

Ich bin ein Appellant-Lawyer.

Und ich habe ein paar meiner größeren Träume auf Appel gemacht,

wie Dwayne Herring und Christopher Pittman.

Und wir haben uns für Jahre gemacht.

Und wir haben uns reingekriegt

bei der annualen Frostgears-Konferenz.

Das ist im September.

Und ich habe ihn mitgebracht.

Und natürlich sind wir in seinem Baptist preacher.

Ich glaube, er ist der Sonne des Baptist preachers.

Und in seinem Baptist preacher Style.

Und ich habe ihn mit den Wattenspielen gemacht.

Und ich habe das Roboto-Argument gemacht.

Und das war toll.

Ich beginnete mit den Litzen.

Ich habe genug von ihnen gemacht.

Ich wollte mich auf jeden Fall aufheben.

Und jeder war einfach krass.

Weil wir stark fühlen,

dass das System in Süd-Karolina unruhig war,

along mit Ellick Murdoch,

wollten wir Kraton's Gedanken aufnehmen.

Hier ist was er gesagt hat.

Ich bin ein Firm-Belieber.

Und es ist nicht perfekt.

Und wir alle wissen das.

Aber ich arbeite mit der Städte Grangerie.

Es ist wirklich unique.

Denn Grangerie,

und wie die Städte Grangerie operiert,

ist es nicht so wie die Städte Grangerie.

Wir kommen in sehr gutem Detail

vor der Städte Grangerie.

Denn es ist eine verabschiedete Procedur.

Und so haben wir,

wir verabschieden Wattenspielen.

Wir haben viele unserer Stimmen.

Und weil es eine verabschiedete Procedur ist,

und wir die Städte Grangerie verabschieden,

haben wir viel zu tun.

Und das kann wirklich helfen,

dass wir uns verstehen,

wie die Städte Grangerie

und viele andere Städte

verabschieden,

und wie es wichtig ist,

dass sie mit einem anderen verabschieden.

Und das für mich

ist meine Belief in unserem System.

Und als Generalist.

Und das ist nicht,

um die Röschkohle zu tragen,

um die Röschkohle zu tragen,

sondern ich denke,

dass es eine gewisse Kollektivität gibt,

mit den 12 Leuten auf der Strecke,

um sie in den Raum zu bringen

und diese riesige, wäldige Beschläge zu haben.

Und,

und,

und,

das ist das,

das ist das,

das ist das,

das ist das,

das,

und das,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

und,

Und ich denke, dass, wie wir das anschauen,

ein paar Dinge, die wir besser machen können,

sobald nur das Prozess selbst ist,

natürlich haben wir diese Intensiv-Media-Aktion,

eine Sache, in der ich sehr, sehr hart versuche.

Und ich denke, dass ich von den Vertretern von mir, die Leute, die ich gesagt habe,

über das Versuch zu protectieren,

ein paar von den Evidenzen in diesem Falle,

v.a. die Alltapsi-Photographs und die Chromstein-Photographs,

dass wir dieses Falle erinnern müssen,

dass es um das Magien-Paul passiert ist,

dass wir erinnern müssen, dass diese Familie

mit einem bestimmten Familien-Familien-Familien

die Falle erinnern müssen.

Und ich wollte einfach versuchen,

weil der Intensiv-Media-Aktion so wichtig ist,

dass es noch ein bisschen Dignität und Privileg für sie ist.

Ich denke, dass es dort hinten ist, wenn ein Fotograf rausgeht,

und das war sehr konzert für mich.

Und also versucht, das Park besser zu integrieren.

Und dann, diese alten Quarthausen,

die Quarthausen sind wirklich für etwas Designen, so etwas wie das.

Und so ist alles so nahe, wir sind auf der anderen Seite.

Das Found-System war nicht das erste Tag,

wir haben eigentlich einen Fender-PA-System,

wie man das mit einem Koffe-Schopfen oder so spielen würde,

und wir haben eigentlich einen Bestbuyer und eine kleine Karaoke-Maschine,

dieidentified wurde, die Thermo-Standarty,

das

Das hatte eine Flasche und eine Liste, die aufhörte.

Das war eigentlich unser Soundsystem.

Es waren Dinge, die wir geplant haben.

Aber wir mussten noch adaptieren.

In dem Ende, als ich die Pressekonferenz gesagt habe,

habe ich gefühlt, was die Ausgaben sind,

dass die Süden-Karate, in den anderen großen Träumen,

viel Nationalverkauf hat.

Ich dachte auf die ganze Zeit, dass die Städte,

Judge Newman, die BALUS, das amazing ist.

Und auch in den beiden Seiten der Prostitution,

dass es so ist.

Ich dachte, dass wir uns ein Prozess zeigen,

wie es funktioniert.

Wir haben auch über die enormen Ressourcen gesprochen,

die die Städte für diesen Fall dedikated,

und warum es notwendig war.

Also, da gibt es viele Dinge,

und ich denke, das ist ein guter Punkt.

Wenn es ein fairer Kritik ist,

dass unser Gesetzessystem, das Geld und die Ressourcen

immer noch wichtig sind.

Dieser Fall ist komplett ungewöhnlich,

aber das ist das, was die Städte und die Prostitution

und die Städte für die Städte und die Ressourcen machen.

Und natürlich,

wir werden die entsprechenden Ressourcen,

die wir denken, notwendig sind,

um einen sehr komplexen Fall zu testen.

Das andere ist, dass,

wiederum, die Weichkohler-Kasen

immer noch ungewöhnlich sind.

Und ich will es klar sagen,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

dass es immer noch ungewöhnlich ist,

aber es gibt andere

Aber wenn du die Begründung hast, die wir viel tun, ist die Korruption, die Publikum, die

komplexen Narkotik-Rings und so weiter.

Aber wenn du die Begründung hast, die die

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I don't have digital, I don't have digital squad

It's not having what you want, it's wanting what you've got

I'm gonna soak up the sun, I'm gonna tell everyone to lighten up

I've got no one to blame, for every time I feel lame I'm looking up

I'm gonna soak up the sun, I'm gonna soak up the sun

I've got a crummy job, it don't pay near enough

To buy the things it takes, to envy some of your love

Every time I turn around, I'm looking up, you're looking down

Maybe something's wrong with you, that makes you out the way you do

I'm gonna soak up the sun, I'm gonna tell everyone to lighten up

I'm gonna tell them that I've got no one to blame

For every time I feel lame I'm looking up

I'm gonna soak up the sun, while it's still free

Don't have no master suite, but I'm still the king of me

You have a fancy ride, but baby, I'm the one who has the key

Every time I turn around, I'm looking up, you're looking down

Maybe something's wrong with you, that makes you out the way you do

Maybe I am crazy too

I'm gonna soak up the sun, I'm gonna tell everyone to lighten up

I'm gonna tell them that I've got no one to blame

For every time I feel lame I'm looking up

I'm gonna soak up the sun, I got my 45 on, so I can rock on

From Luna Shark Productions

Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.