Between Two Beers Podcast: HAMBASSADORS #8: Which Guests Need a Follow Up? Steve’s Gambling Problem, and more!

Welcome to episode 8 of Ambassadors, our show that takes you behind the scenes of the Between

Two Beers podcast.

How are we doing, Shay?

Good.

Second episode, Ambassadors episode in Hamilton in a row.

Yeah.

Making it a thing.

Yeah.

I've come in fresh from Quiznight Tuesdays.

Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You're in that stage of the relationship.

We still do activities together.

Yeah.

Actually, speaking of, Doc Brown is big on orienteering.

Doc Brown being your...

Do you call her Doc Brown to her face?

Yeah, I've started to.

I mean, anyone else seems to call her Doc Brown in chats that I've been.

Yeah.

Because Seamus' new love interest is a doctor.

I don't know if you pick up on that audience, but should they one day get...

Man, I'm not foreshadowing here, but she could potentially be Dr. Martin or Doc Martin,

right?

Yeah, of the shoe.

Of the shoe thing.

Yeah, you got it.

Yeah, you got it.

Potentially.

He is big into orienteering and adventure racing, not obstacle racing, like long 12-hour, 24-hour

races.

I'm not built for that, but I did agree to try what's known as a rogaine in the business.

The hair thing.

It is, but it's also not...

That's what I know.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I know you know that.

On Sunday, it was good fun.

There's like an app that you download, and then there's like a course, and you've got

45 minutes to...

Am I selling it to you?

You've got 45 minutes to get to as many points as possible, and they actually give you physical.

Have I lost you?

No, you're selling me on your relationship, because I can see you're happy about this,

but you've had what I might call a complicated relationship with the outdoors.

So...

What do you mean?

Well, orienteering, going out, doing walking and things, that's not the shade I know.

I like this shade.

No, I love walking in the outdoor, and I love the outdoors.

Yeah, I'm happy for you, man.

Yeah, it's good.

It's good.

I should have you along.

Come along for a rogaine, and try some rogaine.

Look, I'm not against it.

I'm not against it.

I've heard good things about orienteering, so...

Yeah, I think it gets a bad rap.

I think that bad rap maybe started at high school with like, dorky kids, and I'll be

honest, it's a little bit dorky, but it appealed to my dorky side, which I hide away from.

You're at an age where you've got to embrace the dorky.

Like, who cares what people think of you, right?

Like, you've got no reputation to protect at this point.

No, not anymore.

And also, it was kind of evident to me, like, how disconnected I am, maybe, from people,

with that meme that we used on social media, with the McDonald's bag, and my head on Kevin

James's...

But I didn't know anything about what that was, or what it even referred to.

So there will be people that don't know either.

Kevin James, famous actor, and he's kind of got that hunched over look, like, he doesn't

really know, he's a bit sheepish, and it's everywhere.

It's a meme.

Yeah.

I googled it to try and figure out what it meant.

Yeah.

I still don't really know what it means.

Yeah.

But all that can be used in lots of different ways, it's a meme, but our marketing maestro

put James' head on it and reflected, you know, every time someone brings up the Olympics,

Shay wants to tell his story, but he's kind of like a little bit gun-shy about it, which

isn't really the case.

No, I still don't really understand the meme.

No.

It's just a funny picture.

The other one I've seen doing the rounds is, like, 90s pics, like your face with a whole

bunch of 90s things, which I think is odd for people that actually grew up in the 90s.

You just used photos of yourself.

Mmm.

Yeah, you are sounding old, eh?

Just like, you don't get things anymore.

No.

You're just a little bit detached, and each year you get a little bit further away.

Yeah, and that's why when I'm forced into these social media things, I don't know what

they mean.

I don't know what they mean.

To the point also, just speaking of our age, on the Haley Holt episode, Doc Brown came

home this morning from her morning run and listened to the episode and said, why did

you say that you were 42 on the episode?

Because you're not.

You're 41.

Yeah.

Yeah, I guess I'm just got my age wrong.

I'm just at that stage.

It does get a bit like that.

I struggle with my age.

I don't know how old you are.

I'll be honest.

Yeah.

And I don't want to say publicly, but I certainly have struggled to know what my age is when

telling it to people.

What is?

No, I'm not going to say that.

Okay.

So, do you want to know how my week was?

Is that, is this the point where you say, how about you, Steve?

What have you been up to, Steve?

Thanks for asking, bro.

Went on another podcast last week.

Oh.

Yep.

I didn't know that.

Yeah.

Relatable chapters out on Friday.

We often talk about people's experience being on our podcast, and it was the most I've ever

talked about myself.

He gave it the between two years experience.

How long?

It was 90 plus minutes.

Right.

Just me.

Yep.

I'd never really talked about, which is the experience that our guests have.

And I was talking about, did you cry?

You've got a history of crying on this one, but I did talk about gambling and poker.

And when I was retelling my story, yeah, as a professional poker player, and did this,

and he's like, well, what's the relationship with gambling?

Do you have a gambling problem?

And it's like, yeah, no, I did, I did have a gambling problem.

And then I told the story about how when I used to walk home from town in Hamilton, I'd

go past the casino every day, and one night I emptied my bank account, about $3,500 at

the roulette table, got $100 out, tried to double it, tried to double it, tried to double

it, tried to double it, woke up in the morning and wrote a note to my mum, because I was

staying at my parents' house saying, mum, I need to talk, I've got an issue.

Did you retell this on the Luke Keemys episode?

Yeah, I think so.

Or a version of it?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's right.

But it's something, yeah, maybe I had told that bit before, but in more detail, I was

like, fuck, no.

Yeah, no, I did have an issue, but I got control of it, and I don't do that anymore.

So, yeah, therapeutic.

Did you feel better afterwards?

Yeah, I did.

I did.

I messaged them.

I said, that was cool.

And again, that's how I think people, like he put a lot of time and thought and preparation

into the episode and what we were going to talk about, which I respected.

So again.

And that drops when?

Friday.

That's on Friday.

Yeah, you can find that on Friday.

Relatable chapters.

We had a, every so often in this between two beers ride, we have these moments where we

have to talk serious business and things, and things that are changing and there's need

for some serious, like, what do you want to do?

Like, what's the, what's the, what's the, I don't want to do this anymore.

So you came around and I said, come over coffee, man, we need to talk about some things.

And we ended up going to the dump.

Let's tell the real story.

I said, let's meet for a coffee.

Yeah.

And you said, I had a million kids hanging off me, like, no, just come here.

Just come here.

And then you did.

And I said, well, you've got that big old car yours.

Can we go to the dump and take a bunch of stuff and chill on the way?

Which I think, I think, I think if you've got my advice to anyone out there, if you ever

need to have a serious conversation with someone that you don't really want to have, get in

the car with them so they can't escape.

Yeah.

Go to the dump.

Go to the dump.

But that was a good conversation.

It's a positive thing.

It's just every so often we need to break through the shit-talking silliness and having proper

chats.

Maybe once every six months.

Never being serious.

So we did have another one.

I enjoyed that dump drive and you were trying to get me to cut in early and, like, rush

the dump drive.

And I was like, nah, let's just sit in each other's space and talk shit over.

And we did.

And it was good.

I enjoyed it.

Yeah.

Actually, there's quite a lot that's happened in the last two weeks.

The election night coverage.

And my question to you was you had a choice between two, between two beers guests on election

night, didn't you?

You had Jack Tame on TVNZ or Patty Gower on three.

Which way did you go?

I'm quite conservative and traditional in my consumption of television media.

So I was on TVNZ with Jack Tame.

I was TVNZ too.

Sorry, Patty.

Sorry, Patty.

I don't know why.

I don't know.

I don't have a reason.

No, I do.

You know what?

I've got the PlayStation, the PS5, and it has TVNZ built into it, but it doesn't have

New South.

Do you not run a...

Nah.

I don't run that situation.

So it's TVNZ.

Wow.

That was my decision.

Forced upon you.

Your hand forced upon you.

But two great operators.

Yeah.

So, yeah, I wouldn't have been happy either way.

He was fizzed by all accounts.

Yeah, there was.

There was that social media clip going around with him.

Yeah.

He was just...

John Campbell was pretty rocked up too on TVNZ.

It's their big night, mate.

Elections.

And I was asleep by nine, much to the disappointment of Doc Brown snoring on the couch as the change

of guard in New Zealand carried through.

Right, so how about some reflections on the last couple of guests, Jamal Pairata.

The catalyst for Loki Legends.

Yeah.

So that one dropped last week.

And I'm so happy with the reception of this.

This idea that we can just platform anyone with an amazing story and goodwill will come

to them.

So we had some really cool messages from Jamal saying he's overwhelmed with the response.

He's got something which is so worth it, such a good cause and people need to be feeding

into it and helping this thing grow because it's going to help so many people.

And he's just like the amount of messages I've had from people I used to work with and

friends and people I don't know, he said it was really cool and that to me is really

cool.

Yeah, the universe has responded.

I got a really cool message from another former guest, Russell Packer, talking about

how powerful Jamal's messages were and speaking to him.

And I felt that through the episode, like there were times where he was telling his

story and there were elements that were really, really relatable to me, particularly around

like relationship with alcohol, it was profound.

And I really enjoyed, I think I said to you on our dump run, just to listen back.

I was listening back to find something very specific for one of our social media clips

and then it was just running.

I just ran it for another 40 minutes, just listening back to what he had to say.

And if you haven't listened to it, I'd encourage you to go and listen to it because it's a

decent episode.

Yeah, I always really value people's time and attention and I know that there's so many

podcasts and so many options out there.

So when you're serving up someone who doesn't have name recognition, they're kind of trusting

that you're just putting someone up good.

So one of our best mates, Jeremy Field, messaged us and he said he's listened to a whole bunch

of episodes across the 145.

He said that was his favorite ever episode.

So it's stuff like that.

Yeah.

It's really cool.

What about Hailey?

Hailey was cool.

Like what a breath of fresh air, like such a fun, upbeat, good energy, just there for

the bands, but also like so much substance to her had some good, good response from that.

Yeah, it was it was good.

And again, selfishly, personally, like her talking about her relationship with alcohol

again, it was, we didn't record those back to back, but again, on listen back, I'm like,

oh man, so super relatable.

And again, really cool feedback, a really interesting area, I think that we received

recently was just around men's role in and around miscarriage.

Did we get some feedback in from Ambassador Universe?

Yeah, we had a question in on our Ambassadors group.

Any plans on making some follow up episodes?

So I responded, who would you like to hear again?

And it was Hailey, believe it or not, the most recent guest.

But it was based around talking about the man's role in miscarriage.

The comment said something like, yeah, reflecting on Hailey, that conversation needed more,

which was interesting.

Yeah.

We kind of brushed over it, didn't we?

At the at the end, it was almost I had it on my notes.

And it's probably what the comment is kind of speaking to is it's an awkward, icky,

tricky area in life to kind of have to navigate.

I think I asked a similar question in the Laura McGaldrick episode because she lost

the baby as well at some point.

So cool, I guess that we're creating an area that people are coming to, to have some guidance

or get some guidance or some tools on how to navigate those kind of areas.

It's cool.

In both of those episodes, when you, because you asked the question both times, I was watching

their response and they were both so happy and excited that you asked it, like looking

forward to answering.

In fact, that's such a good question that I don't get asked enough.

So well done, man.

Yeah, cool.

Oh, that's nice.

We did get another Facebook comment on the Hailey episode that this was thread, wasn't

it?

Because the reel got dropped.

Celebrity is boring.

You guys should interview someone who works at Countdown.

This gentleman's profile, he's an older man, he was a boomer, for sure.

Yeah, I liked that someone in the universe came to our rescue and it just kind of carried

on a little bit.

I'm not sure how interesting an episode with someone that works.

No disrespect to any, no disrespect to any low key legends that work at Countdown.

We just probably need to do a bit more research into finding the right representative of

Countdown together.

I love those like snotty comments from grumpy old people.

But looping back to the previous question, the plans to make some follow up episodes.

We have talked about this, haven't we?

Who would be on your list to do a round two with our first ever round two?

Yeah, we teased this idea between us ages ago and it was around Emma Twig initially because

when we interviewed her for the first time, she was preparing for Tokyo 2020 and she's

since got her gold medal that she was chasing for so long and we haven't had a chance to

talk about it.

She's also become a mother as well.

So it kind of took really significant life events to add to that chapter already.

So that would be one of my first kind of candidates for a follow up episode, anyone from you off

the top of your head?

David Nica.

Right here, David Nica and Danny Morrison, we could go round two with them.

I think Mark Ellis, we could do another really awesome 90 minutes with Mark Ellis with stuff

we didn't talk about and now that he's involved with the Highlanders, there might be potential

for that.

You know, he might want to get his, not that he needs it, get his name out there.

Yeah, I'm really going to need to fucking out.

I think another idea for follow ups would be episodes where we didn't have the video,

like guess where we had great conversations but we didn't have video.

Daniel Keriopa, Daniel Keriopa, Daniel's going to say Daniel Video, Daniel Keriopa,

Daniel Keriopa, Ross Taylor, even David Galbraith, DG, those would be great to add

that video element to with around two.

Yeah, you're a big video going now.

Rick Solito was the one.

Remember we had amazing guests, so much to say, but he kind of had to go for dinner.

In the studio again.

I think we pushed the time back or something and he was like, look, lads, I've got guests

over, I've been keeping them waiting for 20 minutes, I've got to go.

I was like, yeah, fair enough, Rick, but there's a bit of meat left on that bone.

We recorded it in the Hamilton export beer garden studio and we were kind of doing that

weird stepbrothers, like one in front of the other situation, that whole pan-pan thing.

It was such an odd setup.

We've improved.

We've improved our game, Rick.

Come back.

A question from the Fun Bag.

I am starting my own podcast.

What are some goals I should have for audience?

What were your download numbers across your first year?

You may as well answer this yourself because you're the metrics guy.

I've got no idea what our numbers were.

Great.

I love this question.

Expect no one to listen.

Expect no one to listen for the first year because no one will.

Especially if you don't have a profile or you don't have a name and you're just doing it.

I think across our first year, we did 10,000 downloads.

I think it took us 25 episodes.

I think we did 25 episodes in our first year and it was 10,000 downloads.

Most of those would have been through for episodes 20 through 25.

The good thing is when we started out, we didn't know what was good.

We thought we got 50 lessons or downloads on an episode.

I remember we should get those chat logs.

Holy shit.

50 people listen to this.

We're on fire.

This thing's picking up steam.

Even thinking 25 episodes in a year, we're doing 52 a year now.

Even just the output in a single year.

That's good.

Anyway, this guy did the podcast with last week.

He's done one every week.

He got to his 50th episode and hasn't missed a week.

That's hard.

Stick with it.

That's really hard to do.

Goals should be really low.

No expectation, right?

It can't be an expectation based on trying to build an audience.

You've got to do it for the right reason.

I think I've talked about this before.

Goals should be to continuously put something out.

If you get 50 people listening, amazing because it is hard.

There's so many podcasts out there.

A lot of battle for audience.

Don't get too disheartened if the audience isn't there initially

because if it's good, over time, audience will come.

I reckon, did we have a conversation where it was kind of like

as long as we're happy with the finished product

that was enough gratification?

Yeah, and it doesn't take much.

It only takes one or two pieces of feedback to come in.

Someone who really enjoyed the episode.

And it's still now, really.

It's just one or two.

Like, oh, fuck, okay, that was cool.

Yeah, definitely.

Remember, it used to be three pieces of feedback.

We had three pieces of positive feedback on an episode.

We'd done a good job.

I'd go back and listen to it.

I wish you'd listened to it.

How do you choose your low key legends from Paul Simpson?

Good question, Paul.

A while ago, we put out a social media post asking for feedback

and we had a ton of...

If we haven't got back to it, sorry, it's just a numbers thing.

Resend it.

We had so many good potential guests coming through

and we still do on a weekly basis.

So Dwayne Dalton stood out.

Jamal stood out.

There's a few others in the pipeline.

But yeah, we look for across, I don't know,

a variety of factors.

Epic story, what they've gone on to achieve,

the adversity they've been through,

the message there is going to help people.

So it's a cool place to be

because there are so many stories like Jamal's,

which are largely untold.

And I feel like we've got a platform to share some of these

for the first time.

So really excited about low key legends.

Question from Dan.

He said, Shamus, why aren't you keen

on the come under pressure workshop?

That's coming after the Jamal episode.

I think right at the end,

I was like, let's get you on there

and you kind of embedded the question away.

Yeah, cards on the table.

I'm really scared about running the dunes.

Like I'm just right at the top of the episode.

Well, maybe it feeds into at the top of the episode.

Your observation that I'm not exactly an outdoorsman.

I'm not exactly a picture of physical fitness right now either.

So the thought of running the dunes,

I think I've never liked shit like group fitness.

Like that whole being exposed is like the most unfit person

in a group, which I've quite often been.

So that element of it frightens me a little bit.

I'm not super confident underwater as well.

But I guess that's kind of the focus of the workshop

is kind of keeping your mind calm

in those pressure situations.

It is.

And walking towards experiences or things

which scare you or challenge you

or make you uncomfortable is it?

But what I would say to that is that it is the most supportive place.

Like no one is thinking,

oh, this guy's the most unfit person in the group.

Everyone is there to work on themselves

and it's such a supportive bunch.

So yeah, it's just self doubt.

But that was from Dan,

who I was on the Come Under Pressure workshop with

and you guys had a bit of a back and forth voice note.

That was really good.

Yeah, yeah.

It was nice.

I remember saying it.

It's confronting.

Like when someone comes at you with a direct question like that

because it's an uncomfortable answer.

But I thought, oh, fuck, I may as well front foot it.

And again, to his credit straight away is like,

look, I'm not intending to be confrontational.

It was more curiosity

because you've got this amazing opportunity presented to you

almost on a plate.

Why are you not wanting to lean into it and go towards it?

So 2024, watch this space.

I'm not going to go back to Shane Cameron, though,

on their fitness app.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Look, watch this space.

Yeah.

Nicely done.

Rugby World Cup in full swing, semi-final this weekend.

Watched some good code last weekend.

I'm not normally a Cody, but some good games of code.

Watched it with the fam.

Oh, god, why?

What character have you slipped into?

Watched some code with the fam.

I'm a rugby guy.

How many All Blacks games have you watched out of the five

that they've played?

All of them.

You've watched all of them.

You've not missed one.

I haven't watched all of all of the games.

Like the Mibia and Uruguay games,

you obviously switch off after 10 minutes

when they're up about 30 now.

But yeah, I've enjoyed the games on the weekend,

and which got me thinking, Sam Cain, great ambassador.

Oh, yeah.

What a performance.

We need to get him in the studio.

Before that, though, Foster, right?

Oh, 100% Foster.

Foster's done after this.

He's going to come in and share.

100%.

If you share all his stories.

I imagine he'll probably take a hiatus.

But he would be, we're yet to have an All Blacks coach on.

It would be great to have a Foster on.

Or Sir Graham would be good.

Who would be the best rugby mind that you could get on?

Well, there's only the Professor.

Oh, Wayne Smith.

Sir Wayne Smith.

You've got a real bad habit of missing people's royal titles.

This is a painful way of teasing out.

We've got Wayne Smith coming on on Monday.

We recorded.

We recorded.

We recorded.

We recorded.

We recorded.

We recorded.

Yeah, recorded here in Hamilton again.

Yeah.

Yeah, we did.

One of our best friends and sponsors.

Our first sponsor, Carl Bloxham, let us record in his bar,

which was a nice full circle moment to get one of the greatest

coaches in New Zealand rugby history to his establishment

to have two hours and ask him anything we wanted.

Probably should have asked him to switch the fridge off before

we started recording because there's a little bit of audio

feedback there.

There's this big bar.

It does shut down, but there's a big fridge in every 20 minutes.

Apologies if the audio is a little ropey on that one.

Good content.

Like a very focused mind, isn't he, on rugby?

Yeah.

We tried to pull him in a few different directions,

but he stuck to his code.

Yeah.

He's big on code.

Big on watching code.

Anyway, let's wrap this up.

Hey, last things.

Some really cool opportunities coming up in the live arena.

We're going to be a bit cryptic about this,

but yeah, some cool stuff happening across the next few months.

Hopefully have more info on it in the next few weeks.

Let's just say we've both started shredding.

Give away.

All right.

That's enough for today.

Thanks for tuning in.

Thanks for your support and catch you next time.

See you later.

Bye.

Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.