Sky Sports F1 Podcast: 'The Red Bull junior team is not successful anymore' | Alguersuari on why de Vries was sacked by AlphaTauri?

Hello, everyone. Welcome to this week's episode of the Sky Sports F1 podcast with me, Matt

Baker. And this week, I'm joined by a guy who's had a fascinating career in Formula

One at Torrosso and is now a hugely successful DJ and music producer. Please welcome Jaime

Algristrari. Jaime, how are you?

I'm very good, thanks.

Very good. Where are you joining us from?

I'm in Barcelona. This is my home place and where I was born. And yeah, very happy to

be living here. You know, it's an excellent city, full of sunshine and good food and nice

people.

Yeah. Sounds fantastic. Jaime, there's so much I want to talk to you about. So I'm just

going to try and give our listeners a bit of an overview of what we're going to talk

about in the discussion. So I want to get into your career, your Formula One career, time

with the Red Bull family. And I think there's just some interesting conversations to have

around what's happening at Alcatari or Torrosso, your former team with Nick DeVries being replaced

by Daniel Ricciardo at the moment. So I want to get your thoughts on that. I want to also

talk about junior programs in Formula One, your thoughts on if they work or not, and

if there's still a place for them in Formula One. And also, we have to talk about your

music career as well, because yeah, I was listening to some of your tracks before we

start the interview and I was really, really good, really enjoying them. So yeah, we'll

get into those as well. But Jaime, take us back to the start of your career and how did

the relationship with Red Bull come about? Where were you and who approached who?

Well, it's an actually interesting, you know, what happened was that I was in my last year

of karting. I did this contract. It was actually my first contract with this karting manufacturer

called Intrepid in Italy. So I was only 14 years old. And I was racing ICA category,

international category of karting. It went really well. I won a couple of championships

and came vice world champion. And basically, well, here in my family, we never thought

about Formula One or being a racing driver. We just, I was just doing my thing in karting

like many other drivers. You know, if you ask like Alonso and all these guys, they never

thought of becoming Formula One drivers. They were just professionals at what they did and

it was karting by then. And this is what we were where we all came from, you know. So,

you know, my heroes were all these, Alessandro Manetti, Davide Forret, all these guys that

they had like long careers and very successful careers in karting. But at some point, you

know, I received this phone call from from this, Danny Sullivan and Helmut Marco, they

were doing this Red Bull Junior selection, the driver selection in Portugal in Estorio

in 2005. And basically, they were doing this 45 50 driver selection. And they were selecting

like four or five drivers out of 50. And it was like a test of two days. And the test

was very simple. You had to do like five or six laps with one car. And then we put new

tires without knowing the track and anything. So, you know, they didn't have much time that

they had to test every single driver. So there was like very little testing time for every

driver. And I guess by the end of the day, they were selecting all these five drivers.

It was like a kind of a master chef kind of casting thing. The test went really well.

I topped the times before putting new tires. So I put new tires and then I went even quicker.

And they, you know, Helmut already like wanted me to sign the contract of the, you know,

getting in the junior team. I wasn't really aware of what happened at that time. You know,

I was like too young. It was just, I didn't even understand what was going on. And then,

yeah, I started to drive for them and started my single-seater career, basically.

What were your first impressions of the likes of Helmut Marke and Christian Horner? Once you got

into that Red Bull family, were they welcoming? What were the first impressions?

I actually didn't know Christian since Formula One. And I actually didn't really have a very

extended long relation with Christian Horner, to be honest. Everything was managed by Helmut.

Everything was going through Helmut and all the phone calls were coming from Helmut.

So I had a good relation with Dr. Marke, or even though many people don't think about it.

He's the policeman of the junior team, but it's his job. I mean, the junior team program is a very

strict and very demanding program, but it has to be, you know, they pay for your career.

They have been sponsoring, like they sponsored many, many drivers. Like if you guys study and

make a list of how many drivers they spot, you would be surprised. It's a huge amount of money

they have invested in drivers. And of course, you know, if you have more drivers to sponsor,

to test and to try, you get very good drivers out of them, like champions, like really,

really amazing drivers. The way they act and the way they sometimes it's not fair,

but it's the way it is. Sometimes it's not, like in my opinion, on how they,

what they did for me with me, with Buemi, is not like really a sporting,

say, a very generous sporting manner to get rid of two drivers because it was not decided on

results. It was decided on other things, like commercial and politic, interesting, you know,

things. But that's the way Formula One sometimes works and you have to accept it,

you're part of it. But I had a good time with them and I enjoyed every single moment. Even

the pressure moments were fine because if you cannot deal with that pressure, you cannot deal with

the moment that you have a winning car and you are about to become world champion or you have

to deliver, you know? So, you know, I agree with the way they work. I just don't agree with how

sometimes they apply things to some drivers, but just to get things, you know, to be very,

very sure of what we say is that if you don't deliver results, if you don't

... if you are not in the right performance or where you should be, they have the right to get you

out because, you know, they are asking you for the best. Do you think that reflects ... I mean,

what you just say there kind of does reflect Formula One in general, doesn't it? Ultimately,

there's only 20 drivers. There's only, well, I mean, 24 races is quite a few races per season,

but you don't get many opportunities in Formula One to prove yourself. I guess it's a good opportunity

to talk maybe a little bit about what happened to Nick De Vries and he only had 10 races in the

Alfa Tauri and we must also remember this is not the fastest car on the grid. This is one of the

slowest cars on the grid. It is true, but you have to see a line of improvement. If there is no line

of improvement, they have the right to get rid of you. You have to show at least ... I mean,

he had very little races to show his total performance. I'm sure there was much more

coming from Nick, but if there was no line of no growth of performance from the first race

to the last race, they have the right to do that. At the end of the day, listen, Formula One is about

killing your teammate. You know, he has the same tools than you and my whole goal when I was in

Choroso and I can, of course, tell you my example because that's what I live. It was about beating

my teammate, making sure I was ending the season with more points on the scoreboard than him.

That was the only way I could provide money to my team. So money means delivering results.

When you beat your teammate, you have the right to stay. You cannot compare against anyone. They

were asking us to win races in Formula One and we were not able to beat Mercedes at that time

with Schumacher and Rosberg or Lotus or Renault or Force India. They had much more budget than us.

They were teams more developed than Choroso. It was only the second year of the car. So,

you know, asking for miracles is not possible, but asking to deliver the maximum out of it,

it is possible. So if you beat your teammate and you're doing well and you're putting the cars in

the car in the points, when it's not a car where it's supposed to be in the points,

then you're delivering. You're doing a good job. You know what I mean?

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Well, just to compare a couple of, you know, for example,

Yuki Senoda at the moment, you know, you in your final season before you were let go by

Choroso, you got seven top tens, which was a good season. And Yuki at the moment,

he's got two tenth place finishes. We're halfway through the Formula One season. So

do you maybe perhaps see the Red Bull or the Red Bull program as it were,

has maybe got a bit more lenient on drivers? Do you think that maybe looking back, that was

obviously very harsh with what happened with yourself? But where do you see that example

with Senoda sitting? For me right now, and I'm going to be very clear with you, the fact that

Checo Perez is driving for the Red Bull Racing team is quite clear that the Red Bull Junior team

is not any more successful. Because the whole idea, and that's what they told us, and that's what

they told to the media and everyone is that we're building up champions, or we're building up the

best drivers we can, and give them an opportunity to drive for Choroso nowadays, Alpha Tauri.

In order that they get experience in Formula One, so we can upgrade them to the bigger team,

which is Red Bull Racing. The fact that they had to go somewhere else to find a driver,

to be driving for them at Red Bull Racing is already a controversy. It doesn't make sense,

you know what I mean? So you're spending millions for many, many years, and I'm telling you,

a lot of money, a huge amount of money for many drivers to become champions at junior categories,

to then put them into Formula One, give them a very little chance crossing the fingers that

they get a good car, because otherwise you do nothing in Formula One if you don't have a good

car, you're in the back, and you can show nothing but winning your teammate, and then crossing the

fingers that you get a chance to drive for a winning car, which is the Red Bull Racing team.

Just by the fact that they are going somewhere else to find, and my huge respect to Teko, you know,

I've raced with him in Formula Three, in other racing series, so I know him really,

really well, and I know the job that he has now is a very difficult job, because Max is a

extraordinary driver, probably the best driver in the world right now.

He knows the team, the car, and Teko is struggling big time, and I know there's much more to come

from him, but we have to be very clear, you know, like Teko was never in the junior team, and if he

was considering how Helmut Marco judges drivers, he would have not lost a year. He would have

had a second chance in GP2, he would have not given him a second chance in British Formula Three,

like we know these things, you know, I know nowadays there's a lot of new fans to Formula One,

but they have to understand the history about where they come from, and how the Red Bull Junior team

works, you know what I mean. Yeah, well to build on your point there, the fact that Liam Lawson,

for example, one of the Red Bull Junior drivers, was overlooked for the seat that Riccardo has

obviously Riccardo's got, but Riccardo's 34, you know, no disrespect to him, he's 34,

Liam Lawson is 21, so you would argue that, you know, if you're not going to put Liam in there,

then yeah, perhaps your theory that it's not a system that's necessarily working very well

is correct, because surely you'd want to put youth to develop them in Alfa Tauri,

and then bring them into the Red Bull team. That's the thing that is sometimes surprising,

and I'm actually thinking, well, who's taking decisions there? Is it Helmut really?

Is it Helmut with Christian? Is it somebody else behind and acting like a board of

interest and considering who is the best to put at that time, and playing with that?

I've no idea. Listen, when Helmut called me, I was doing the test for the European KZ Championship

in Germany. It was 2009, he called me one week and a half before the Hungarian Grand Prix of

2009. He said, okay, you will drive next week, and you're going to be our official driver. I was

19 years old, I never tested a Formula One car before, and I was like, okay, how am I going to

deal, and how am I going to cope with a two-hour race in a car that I've never driven? So this is

going to be like going to the cemetery already. I have very little tools to defend myself. It's

going to be really hard. They had to make sure they were putting the youngest driver in there,

so it was very difficult for me. That year, I suffered a lot, but they took that decision,

and I could cope with that. There was, I believe, a little grow line, like a developing line from

results, and I was delivering a little bit better, and then the following year was definitely much

better, and obviously 2011 was my best season. But yes, sometimes they just make things that

doesn't make sense, you know, and they take decisions without really a strategy behind,

but it's what it is, you know, and yeah, it's like that.

Well, 2009 at the Hungara ring, it's kind of funny that we're talking to you. The week of

the Hungarian Grand Prix, the week that Daniel Ricciardo comes into Alfa Tauri, your former team,

halfway through the season, what were the challenges of coming? I mean, obviously,

I appreciate you hadn't driven a Formula One car before, as you just said, but what do you think

your challenges were coming in mid-season to a team? I just wanted to finish the race.

Yeah, that was the main goal. We already talked about it before. I was not looking for performance,

I was just trying to be as consistent as possible through the weekend, learning especially the

tires, different compounds. It was the first time in my life that I was using different compounds,

you know, before going to Formula One. You only drive one type of tire and you're only used to

drive this tire. So, for me, it was all about gaining experience through the weekend and making

sure that I was doing all the laps possible and learning of how a Formula One weekend looked like

with my team, mechanics, different engineers, so much data. Formula One is so much different to

other racing series, huge difference. And when you look at the job Daniel's now got to do,

obviously he's very experienced, but what would you deem a successful second half of the season

for Daniel Ricciardo right now at Alfa Tauri? The thing is that the car doesn't look very quick,

so performance of the car is probably 80% of the final result, unless it rains and

things happen during the race. But it looks like Alfa Tauri are struggling with aerodynamics. It has

always been the main element in Formula One nowadays. The modern Formula One, it's all about

finding performance on aero, downforce, fissure downforce, and it looks like Alfa Tauri are

struggling with that. And you can only see, you can see Yuki's performance, how it was last year

and how it is now. It is true that other teams have been developing very well and have, you know,

been doing the step forward and they've moved forward. So it's going to be difficult for Daniel

now, because I'm sure it's, the car is going to feel quite, you know, similar to what he has in

his head, of course, because it's a Formula One, modern Formula One where, you know, he has a lot

of experience. So we will have to see a closer battle between Yuki and Daniel on what's remaining

of the year, I believe. That's what Red Bull expects from Daniel. Yeah. Were you surprised

when he took, when he took that job? No, not really. I mean, I think Red Bull loves Daniel.

I think Christian loves Daniel. All in all, you know, Daniel is a nice guy. He's a fun guy.

He's a professional driver. He's definitely, he knows how to deal with all the things, you know,

and he's a very intelligent guy, a smart guy. And also he's a quick driver. I don't know what

happened in McLaren. I think we've seen the very best of Daniel, you know, like he, when he was

in Toro Rosso at the time, he did two years in Toro Rosso. I think he did a good job. He didn't

beat us, like me and Buemi, on points. But for some reason, he was upgraded to Red Bull Racing.

Five. When he was upgraded to Red Bull Racing, he beat Sebastian and he came third in the world

championship. So that's some big numbers out there. And he didn't have a winning car, you know,

at that time Mercedes had it. So he's a winning driver, you know, he drove for a winning car

and he did some amazing results. So I think he's definitely a very good driver.

We have to see what's happening on his second chance to Formula One.

But I think he has a new challenge and he's well prepared. He's looking forward for

this new challenge. Yeah. Yeah. You mentioned earlier, obviously, that you know Sergio well,

that you've raced against him. Do you think that bringing Daniel in has now put more pressure

on Sergio in that second Red Bull seat? Do you think ultimately the goal

for Daniel is to move from Alfa Tauri to the second Red Bull seat to partner Max?

It could happen. I mean, I think Checo has to focus on being closer to Max. Listen,

I'm going to say something. It's very simple and I don't want to, I wouldn't like that anyone feels

offended. You know, Checo is a good friend of mine and I wish him the very best. But you cannot

really accept to be half a second off your teammate. Even if it's God coming to the best

winning car. I know how it works. You know, it's Formula One. You have a winning car. You have to

use it. You know, and I know many people would think like, Oh, who are you? What are you saying?

Like you've your best place was a seventh place. Like where are you coming from? You know, I didn't

have a chance to drive a winning car. But I'm just saying, listen, your first your first

rival is your teammate. When you have a winning car, you have to use it. You know, you have to go

for it. So it's not acceptable that you're always like half a second, seven, 10 slower. If your

teammate is winning all the races, race after race, at least you have to be in the podium. You know,

it's not like your best day. You're in the podium. Not like you have to be closer to him. Otherwise,

they have they have the right to replace you. You know what I mean? There are many

drivers on the grid, many, many drivers that could be definitely much closer to to Max.

And we can say, yeah, but Max doesn't want a driver who's close to him because he's the leading

driver whatsoever. But I guess every single team wants to make sure they have a balanced pair that

can deliver results. And at the end of the day, can win the World Constructors Championship,

which means more money for the team. The funny thing with Max, I think, at the moment is that by

himself, he could be leading the Constructors Championship, you know, with the amount of

points he's amassed, he doesn't even need a second driver. And that is such as the dominance that

we're seeing from Max. So, you know, maybe, maybe it doesn't happen next year. Yeah. You know what

I mean? Like the dominance that Red Bull has now with Max, it might not last forever. You know what

I mean? Like you cannot, you cannot act in a way that thinking, you know, when you were winning all

the time, there will be a time where you won't be that dominant. You know, it happened to Ferrari,

it happened to Ross Brown with, with Brown GP, it happened to Mercedes, like it doesn't last forever.

And there's one thing that things change. Formula one is about to change in two, three years time,

right? So, you know, you cannot act like that. You need two very good drivers. That's how I would

see it, you know. Back to your own career and your time with the Red Bull family. I mean, how,

looking back on it now, how do you reflect your time in the junior programme and then into your

career? Did you enjoy it? Was it, was it a part of your life that you look back fondly? No, I didn't

enjoy it. Definitely. I didn't have the, I didn't have the, the gift to enjoy because I only had one

chance, you know. If I was not winning at my first year on Formula three, I was getting dropped off.

I only had one chance. For some reason, I don't know, maybe other drivers or chances I didn't

have one chance. I did, I wasn't the favourite, favourite that that time was Brandon Hardley.

He, he was the favourite driver in Red Bull. I was very sure about that. When I won British

Formula three, things changed. Then I was lucky that there was a, you know, a free seat in Toro

Rosso from Sebastian Burde. They dropped him mid-season and they called me to replace him

in the middle of the season, which was completely crazy. But I coped the best I could. I finished

the season, then 2010 looked a bit better. I was definitely much happier and much prepared for Formula

one. And there was a growth, you know, like we started, we started being in the points in my

second race of the season in Malaysia. We scored a couple of points then. And then 2011 was very

difficult. The first beginning of the season with new Pirelli tires. And then the second half was

the best moment of my life. And the biggest mistake was me not signing with Lotus at living

Red Bull. But what are you going to expect? Like you're consistently beating your teammate.

You're expecting to be upgraded to Red Bull. You know, you're all the time consistently in the top

10, knowing that your car is not able to be in the top 10. So how are you going to expect that they're

going to drop you the 18th of December? You know, in the last day of December, I already

launched, I already, you know, we did like this event in Madrid for the media and the Spanish press

with a new car from 2012. We had James Key as the main engineer. So all the project was done.

One day after, they called me and they just dropped me in a one minute phone call.

It was extraordinary. Why? Why? This has happened like one day after we launched the car.

Like why? Who was that phone call with? How did that phone call go?

It was from from Franz Dost. He was just a message, you know, he was just a messenger.

This was coming from the very top. And I'm not even saying Helmut Marko. It was just definitely

coming from somewhere else because I know Helmut would have not dropped me. If there was someone

to drop, there was like someone who lost the battle, you know, from the teammates because

in Formula One, what we said, you know, you have to be your teammate. You have to make more points

than your teammate. Then in Red Bull, at least you have something to defend yourself. And then

they came with this story saying, yeah, we have like, we have dropped them because they are very

good drivers, but they're not winning drivers. And I'm like, well, how do you know we're not

winning drivers if we've never had a winning car? So everything was so strange and difficult.

And I know for real, it was not based on results like no chance, you know, we're beating teams

that they had like doubled the amount of money. And, you know, I was very, I did my best with what

we had. I was I'm sleeping like really, really well at home. Because I know if we had a machine

of going back, like, we could have not definitely done any better. We extract the maximum juice out

of the car, out of the team. It was a very good human team. And they did really, really well.

So I was really, really proud of this 2011 season, honestly. Do you ever think back and if things

had gone differently, if you had been kept on, you know, obviously, because that that was the

last time you race in Formula One, and then you've obviously gone on to have a successful career

in music. But do you ever do you ever look back and go if you had have stayed on for that extra

season, and then it had been a very good season, and maybe you might still be in Formula One now,

you know, do you ever think like that? I always thought on why didn't I take that contract that

Eric Boullier was, you know, offered me in Abu Dhabi. I only had that weekend to sign. So everything

was like, why should I sign and go and leave my team? Which is just my team, you know, they were

my family for six years, like Helmut believed in me in 2005 in, you know, in Portugal. And we were

together for so long. I was doing well in Formula One. So I thought, why would they drop me? Like,

I'm doing good here. Red Bull Racing is a winning car. You're winning the third title with Sebastian.

And I thought, well, you know, I want to stay here, you know, I'm doing well. I'm beating my

teammate, you know, I'm on my peak time, peak moment of my racing career. Why would I leave?

So risky. So sometimes I do regret why I should have now I shouldn't I've signed with with them,

but it was a difficult call. Yeah. Yeah. Just just hearing you talk about that, I do get the

impression with with Red Bull, certainly in those days from your experience, the they were

pretty brutal, pretty cutthroat with with their young drivers. And, you know, would you agree

with that? Would you agree that that was the kind of atmosphere and culture within Red Bull at that

time? Yeah, they've never done this with anyone else. Like what they did to us, they've never done

this to anyone else. And I think they would never do it again. We delivered. That's the thing.

We delivered. We delivered points. We delivered the best out of it.

They have the right to drop any single driver when they don't deliver. When they are not in the

point when they don't deliver results, even if the car is not good, but you're being beaten

consistently by your teammate, they have the right because they have, they have the, you know,

the reason they have the right reason. So that's what I'm saying with Nick. They have a reason.

There's no line of improvement. There's no growth between the first race and the 10th race.

They have the right to drop you off. That's how Red Bull works. And it's fair. They have been

paying for your career since you were a kid, or at least for me. But what I don't understand

is what when you deliver results, when you're being better than your teammate, when you're

beating world champions, when you're beating teams that are bigger than your team, and they have,

they have double as bad as your team, and then they drop you off. Just because they say they're

not winning drivers. Well, what on earth? Why? You know, based on what? You know what I mean?

Like, give me the chance of driving a winning car. And then you judge us if we are not

winning drivers. Sebastian Buemi, he's a good friend of mine. He was my teammate back then,

would not be as clear as me talking like that, because he's, he's a very, he has a different

mindset, but he's a very nice guy. And, and he thinks the same as I do. You know, but sometimes

if Formula One, you have to shut your mouth, you know, to be very smart on how to deal with the press,

what to say. But listen, I have nothing to lose. I make music now.

It wouldn't be a very good podcast, would it? No, exactly. I, I am super happy where I am.

I'm, I release music as a squire. I love my music. I love people being happy and sharing

love and sharing music and dancing to music. I'm in a very different atmosphere right now.

I am so grateful that Red Bull gave me the possibility to drive Formula One and, you know,

help me out to, to be in Formula One without them. It would have not been possible. But listen,

I'm just going to be crystal clear with you guys. So this is what happened. This is the real story.

So it's that. Yeah. Do you, um, do you, have you seen Helmut Marcos since? I mean,

have you been in the paddock much since? Yeah. What's it like? Was it in Silverstone last weekend

or two weeks ago? No, I went and I saw, I saw him. He was not very happy. He tried to avoid me,

but I was going through it. I think he was not expecting, I think he, he didn't know what

to expect really. You know, if he was, if I was in a good mood or I was just going to give him

like so much, you know, I don't care. I always had a healthy good relation with him and make jokes.

So I was like, hey, Dr. Marcos, like, do you, do you remember me? Because he was like 11 or 12

years ago. And he's, yeah, of course, of course, I remember the famous Auguste Swarie,

uh, famous DJ. I'm like, no, no, not famous yet, but not doing bad, not doing bad. No,

it was just a brief, brief talk. Yeah. Yeah. Do you still, I mean, when, you know, do you still

enjoy Formula One? Is it something that you're able to watch now and enjoy and, and, and, and

actively, actively watch? I'm a very good friend of Carlos. I support him massively.

I, I've been really with our families, my family and Carlos family have been very close together

since the Red Bull days. You know, Carlos was in the junior team. He saw, they saw everything or

what happened to me and, and to Buemi. Um, we have very internal serious talks about everyone's

position and I'm really, really happy. Uh, he's now where he is. And, uh, I think the best of Carlos

is yet to come. Uh, he's a really, really mature, excellent, super dynamic driver performing on

every single kind of circumstance. And, and I really wish him the best. He's a really nice kid.

He's an excellent driver again. And I hope he has a bright and long future in Formula One.

What do you think's next for Carlos in terms of, is it the car at Ferrari? What, what needs to happen

for him to take that next step? Because I think, yeah, we, we all agree that he's a phenomenal

talent, phenomenal driver. What will just take him to the next level? Honestly, I think Ferrari

is a team that is made to win historically. You know, it's like, uh, Real Madrid or Barcelona,

or even, you know, like Paris or Manchester City, like there are teams that they have to win.

Like you have to win. You have to go for the Champions League and you have to win it.

If you don't go, if you don't get these results, it's a fail. Well, it's not really a fail, but,

you know, that's what it's supposed to be because you have this structure. You have all the facilities

and you can, you have to your disposition, all these right people to do it. At the moment,

Ferrari is not doing a good job. It's not just the car. It's just the human team. Formula One is not

just about having the best car. It's about having the right people. It's a, it's a company. You know,

it's a, it's a football team. You know, a football team is not just about having the best players.

You see the Paris team, they have the best players in the world and they didn't do anything on

Champions League. So what's the problem is the mentality. It's the attitude. How do you form a

team with the right attitude to becoming a winning team mentality? You know, Red Bull have the best

mechanics. They have, they still have the best timing on tire change, you know, pit stops.

I think they did 1.82 or something like that. And maybe if you see the average timing on pit

stops, they still are the fastest. You know, many other teams could beat that, but they don't. So why?

Because Red Bull are on a state of flow between the mechanics, between, they have like this

order inside the team that makes it works, makes it being and becoming a winning team.

They want to win. They give their very best. And it doesn't seem to happen this in Ferrari.

They mess up with strategies, with tire selection. It's all a drama. It looks like a junior team,

you know, it looks like you cannot perform like that. So there has to be a change in structure,

like internally, it's a human. It's not just having the best aero engineer and designing the best

downforce efficient car in the world. It's just about making sure that your team is ordered and

has the right mentality to becoming a successful team. If you see the days with Ferrari, with

Ross Brunn, they had that. They had this structure. You have to have a structure and an

underlying team that, you know, works with the same mentality and for the same goal.

And I think that's the lack of performance of Ferrari. You know, they don't have this structure.

It's missing. Well, time will tell if Fred Versailles is the right man to bring that structure

back. And just before we move on to talk about your music career, just intrigued to get your

thoughts on Red Bull's domination this season. And obviously Max Verstappen was the driver who

replaced you as the youngest driver to start a Formula One race. You did it at 19 years and 125

days, pretty much 14 years ago to the day at the Hungar Ring, as I discussed. Max was 17 years and

166 days. So when you think that he was almost two years younger than you were, and I think back to

when I was 19, I was pretty young at 19. So I can't imagine how, you know, driving a Formula One car

at the age of 17 must just be ridiculous. But how do you reflect on what Max is doing at the

moment, how he's dominating, how Red Bull are dominating the sport? So I think Max, if we have

to look at his performance and the actual status of Max right now, we have to go back to the cutting

days and analyze that because everything is happening for a reason. Max has a special talent

already. He was born with a special talent, but talent is not just enough. To become the world

best driver in the world, talent is not just enough. Talent has to be worked. Talent has to be

trained. You have to work on talent big time. And Max has something that nobody else has.

He had a preparation and education that nobody else had, a tough and strict

preparation from cutting days. And nobody did that. You know, he was at Gank testing more than

anyone else on slick tires, on wet tires, on, you know, track being wet on slick tires and going

and going and running and running and running. His father being so involved in his cutting program,

tuning up his engines, just going for it with a huge, with a very strict mind of

performing at the very, very high end level. Winning was not enough, which if you look at it,

it's a very similar education. It's a very similar mentality of Red Bull, of the junior team, you

know, the winning is not enough. What happened was when we, when I was an intro Rosso, scoring and

beating Michael Schumacher and scoring, you know, like six points per race or doing eight, nine, seven,

which it was a win for us. It was not enough for them. Everyone was happy around my team, you know,

like the press, the Spanish press, all the teams were even congratulating our results. But Helmut

was not, was just okay. This is what you have to do. So that's what, that's the mentality that Josh

and Max had in mind. And I've raced, I've raced only once against Max. It was the World Cup in

karting in Bahrain, KZ, Q on it. I came ninth. It was obviously my return to karting. I just did

it for training and so on. And so obviously I was not like really a professional in that term,

but it went really well because being in the top 10 was for me an achievement at that time.

And Max won the race. And I remember like, it was the first, it was the time where I met Max.

And yeah, you know, he had to do this. Like, there is no margin for becoming second. Like,

there's no happy faces to go back at home. So I think his dad had a huge influence

on Max's performance at the moment. So if you have to analyze what Max is doing now,

he's becoming from many, many, many years ago. Like you have to analyze what happened in the

karting days when he started, like, was huge, huge, like strict programs and dedication to

what he did. It was a never ending training program on, it's just here, mental-wise, but also

testing, testing, racing and racing and never stopping of doing that. So yeah, like,

hands up, you know, it worked. Nobody beats him. Like, he's on a state of flow. He's doing it easy.

It's not even pushing. It's not even, you know, of course the car is very quick, but I can, I'm

very, very sure if you put Lewis in this car or Fernando or whatever driver you want,

I don't think they would beat him. You think? Yeah. I don't think they would beat him.

Yeah. It'd be good to try, though, wouldn't it? Yeah.

I think we've got three Red Bulls and Max, Lewis and Fernando in there. I think that'll be boxed

off this. That's really, it's fascinating insight, Jaime, really is about what's happening at Red

Bull at the moment. I want to just finish by talking about what you're up to now and obviously

you mentioned that, so obviously you left Formula One and then you raced in Formula E for a bit and

then retired at 25 and then how did the music element to your career come about? Was that

always something you wanted to do or when did that start? Well, it all started in Ibiza.

My parents used to go holidays since the 70s and obviously they took me there. I met a lot of friends.

Ibiza has been always the center of, let's say, summer parties and electronic music

in the summer. And all my friends were into DJing, really. It was the vinyl era at that time and we

had to find the right music in the right stores. It was not us today, like where you find music

on the internet everywhere. So it was just a challenge to who had the best record and what's

the best record sounding like, showing us music, sharing music between us. It all started like a

game and then obviously they were mixing and they were playing records and this basement. So I started

to do that and I really found it really good fun and we started throwing our own parties, like

obviously just for us and our friends and I thought, okay, one day why shouldn't I start trying to make

this like a little beat on my software in the computer and then maybe when I finish this beat

I add some melodies and I do like very essential, like really basic stuff. And I started to release

my first records in 2009, 2010, like very like independent labels from New York. This was as

you got your chance in Formula One. This all happened at the same time. Yeah, wow. That was worried

because we saw that I was like putting a lot of time in my computer and you know, like downloading

plugins and buying sound libraries and recording weird stuff. And then he was like, well, what are

you on about? Like you just became a Formula One driver and you're like really putting all your

time on music. But for me, music has always been like a disconnection point of feeling free, you

know, every time I feel sad, I make music or I listen to music every time I want to train hard.

I listen to music every time that I'm motivated about something or passionate about something,

I listen to music. So music for me brings me life and connects me to life. So it's a language

that it's universal. And even if we don't speak the same language, you understand yourself with

music. All these frequencies that are just about to be made and to be composed are there, you know,

and it's art is something different, you know, it's different to driving a car, but it's just like

freedom of expression. And even when it works and people feel it, obviously then being successful

at music, it's something completely different. But when you make music and somebody feels it,

even if it's one person to 1000, it's magic, you know, it's like pure state of connection.

And this is just incredible. Yeah. Yeah. It seems slightly trite to ask if there's similarities

between music and being a Formula One racing driver. Was there any crossover that you felt?

Was there anything that Formula One prepared you to do well in music? Or do you see them as

completely separate things, you know, this is actually an escape from Formula One, from

competitive sport, from all of the pressure that came with that? Yeah, I think I've learned a lot

from my, not just my Formula One career, especially to becoming, you know, like to being in Red Bull

for many, many years, to have this level of, I would say, like being so strict with yourself,

like just trying to push yourself forward and beyond on everything, like training hard every

day, like being at your best and always asking for more. This is something that I think is helping

me in music, because you're never happy with what you have, you know, you just want to go

further. And you want to, you put this record where you are happy, but you are always listening to

what other people, other people are doing, and you're always analyzing other records, like how did

this guy did this sound or this other, how the, what kind of work method do these other producers

work? How can I improve my DJ performance? You're always into something new. And so all these

inside mentality that you have of developing yourself and becoming a better producer, a better

professional, what you do is what moves you forward. And I think Formula One has helped me

massively on that, you know, like always pushing on trying to push yourself forward and going and

moving beyond of that course. Fascinating. I think what's Formula One seems to have changed

quite a lot in the last maybe five, five years or so, it seems to be moving much more towards

entertainment. I don't know if you agree with that. And I'm intrigued to get your thoughts about,

you know, for example, in Miami, we had Will I Am making a track just for Formula One specifically.

We had the big driver intros. It feels like Formula One, we're going to Vegas this year.

There are lots of elements of Formula One that are now becoming more and more entertainment based,

more even more music based. Would you agree with that? Yeah, yeah. I think it's fantastic. I mean,

I was in Silverstone two weeks ago and I saw a completely different scenario of what Formula

One looks like or what it looked like back in the past. And I was so happy to see that. Like

people from all around the world, it was just, I felt like Formula One has opened

finally their eyes and everything, it looks more easy to understand. It was, it looks much more

entertainment. There's much more around Formula One. I think the Netflix film series helped a lot,

the TV show. And I think the film that it's about to come out, it's going to be amazing as well. So

hands down to that and to the new era of Formula One. Yeah, it's nice to see that.

And just, just finally, give us, give us an overview of how your life has changed. Obviously,

you were, you were a Formula One racing driver, you were, you know, how many weekends of the year

you were driving. Now you're a DJ. What does your week look like? How does it compare to Formula One?

Well, it's very different. I don't, I don't see the press very often right now. Yeah. But

it's fine. I mean, I travel a lot. I, I'm in a very different circle of people.

I make a lot of music every day. I'm on my computer. So I listen a lot of music.

It's important for me to have, to bring, to, to bring something different and offer

something different to every DJ set. Like you cannot really base a set that has been working

for you in the last, let's say two, three months and always trying to repeat tracks. That's not

challenging for me. And many DJs do that. But it's important to, it's important to risk. Like you

have to risk on your DJ sets. Like I find it's super interesting. And sometimes it just doesn't

work. But just the fact that you risk and you put something different, extravagant, avant-garde,

like something that nobody would try. I don't know, when you make it work, it's just amazing,

you know, and I think that's how creative DJs and I think that's what you should look for,

you know, and it's challenging because this requires you a huge amount of hours to research

for music, dig into music and get a big knowledge of music from the seventies to, to the actual

moment, you know, I'm running a label called Anims, which I'm really, really happy and proud of it.

I started last year. Anims is a Catalan word. It's like cheer up. It means cheer up, you know,

like it's like a positive word. We had already like six references. I'm releasing other artists

from all around the world. I've released two records of mine. We're doing remixes as well.

And yeah, just, you know, enjoying my life as a, you know, as a DJ, as a producer, a

traveler as well. And yeah, just having fun with it, which is all about, I think in life,

is about enjoying your job, feeling connected with what you do and just trying to deliver your very

best. Yeah, very well said. Where can people find your music? Are you touring at any point? Like,

if people want to check you out? So Spotify is probably the best platform to find music nowadays.

You just typed my name, Squire, S-Q-U-I-R-E. This is actually my second surname in English.

So, I really, I really, I choose that name. I've started a duo at the moment with a friend called

Paul Position. So we play, we play together. And we have, like what you did there. Yeah,

we, we had good picks already and we had like excellent dates for the, for the coming summer.

So yeah, you can find me on Spotify as Squire. Yeah.

Nice one. Nice one. Well, it's, it's been brilliant to chat to you, Jaime. Thank you so much for your

time. Thank you. You're welcome. And yeah, really, really appreciate it. Fascinating insight to what

it was like at Red Bull and glad to see you're doing so well now. We will be back next Tuesday

after the Hungarian Grand Prix to look back at that. We'll be joined by Nico Rosberg for that.

Hope to see you then. Bye for now.

Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.