Sky Sports F1 Podcast: The inside story of Red Bull's dominance with Calum Nicholas

Hello, everyone. A very warm welcome to this bonus episode of the Sky Sports F1 podcast,

and we're recording this the week after Max has won his third World Championship. Katar

was the weekend before, and we're joined by a very special guest, someone who has been

there for all three of Max's World Championships, and you might recognise the clenched fist

from the celebrations, the slow-mo celebrations. Callum Nicholas, hello, how are you?

Oh, mate, I'm wicked. Thank you very much for having me.

I'm going to give you your full title at Red Bull, Senior Power Unit, Assembly Technician.

That is...

Yeah, we're going to come on to what that means in a little bit, because I'm fascinated

to hear more about that. But this is an amazing time to talk to you, because, as we know,

Max Verstappen won his third World title this weekend in Katar. I want to know, take us

into inside the team, what was the atmosphere like this weekend in Katar?

I mean, obviously, you know, going into the weekend knowing that you had a strong possibility,

you're going to win a World title, sort of brings a certain energy anyway. But in a whole,

that's sort of the energy we've been carrying all season. You know, I think once we realise

we were sort of in a position where we were going to at least challenge, and then obviously

later on, we realised we were going to go on to have a really great season. So it's

just been high energy. It's all year, it's been like a real buzz in the garage. Obviously,

to win it is now a little bit of relief in that, you know, you know, the job you set

out to do is done. But the season itself is obviously not done. So we're still fully focused.

Everyone's like really, really focused and really, really sort of intent on just making

sure we finish the season as strong as we started it.

You know, better than anyone, Formula One is the team sport. But in case there's anyone

who at home who maybe doesn't quite understand just how much of a team is needed in Formula

One, describe how it feels when the whole team wins, you know, when you win a Constructor's

title, when you win a World Championship with Max, it's not just Max Verstappen is it that's

winning the World title. It's everyone around him.

Yeah, I mean, look, look, Max, he goes out there every week and he delivers, you know,

and then obviously that puts the pressure on everyone else like, you know, us at the

circuit, all of the people working back in Milton Keynes to make sure that we deliver

for him. You know, he will deliver on whatever we give him. So if we give him the right product,

we know we're in a good place. It's for me, it's always been like an amazing thing to

sort of be this tiny little part of what turns out to be this great achievement, you know,

and just sort of knowing that you played a little role of the jobs that you do throughout

the year, I've sort of played a little part of making the success happen. So it's quite

nice. It makes me extremely proud. You know, in some ways, it's quite humbling when you

sort of realize the scale of what you achieve every year, you know, the thousands of people

working towards a goal. It's sort of quite nice to sort of just see yourself as this

tiny little cog in it, tiny cog, I reckon you're a bit bigger than a tiny cog.

I don't know, man. I think in terms of just the sheer numbers and the work that goes on,

you know, you have to sort of consider that everyone's role is so crucial, you know, it

doesn't work. Yeah, you know, like the whole is greater than the sum of its parts, you

know, like all of the little jobs that they all have to be done at the same time, everybody

has to sort of commit to it. And obviously it's most visible in the pit lane, you know,

when you think of a pit stop in that sort of way, you understand that it takes all of

those 16, 20 people to all do their job perfectly, all at the same time. And it sort of really

gives you an idea of what it is as a team sport.

And I guess we see you and we see a lot of the pit crew regularly, but there are so many

people on there behind the scenes and Milton Keynes, just describe how large that team is.

And obviously, you know, they're not travelling necessarily to every race, but they are there

working, also working the race weekends, but just from Milton Keynes, right, and contributing

in the same way. Yeah, obviously, you know, we've got lots

of engineers and strategists that are back in the operations room throughout a weekend.

But you know, as a business as a whole, the sport has grown so much, even over the last

10 years that I, you know, when I when I talk to young people about careers in the industry,

I tell them, look, these teams now, there's a job for everyone here, you know, like it's

not just engineers and designers, you know, you've got your strategists, you've got mechanics

and technicians. But then also, you know, we branch down, we've got so much social media,

so much marketing, hospitality, you know, from accounts and HR and all of these other

sort of areas where I say to young people, there is a skill that you have where there

can be the perfect job for you here in racing.

Take us inside then the party. Well, first question is, was there a party on Saturday

night, because obviously you had a race on Sunday, and then was there a party on Sunday

night?

Do you know what? It was, it was, it was a little bit muted last week, just because

of the way the schedule for the race weekend. Obviously, we Saturday night, we had a bit

of work on, we had a car, we had to repair, so we was probably there quite late. And then

Sunday, just because of the nature of it, obviously, was it an 8pm start of a race for

us local time? And then by the time that's done, and then obviously we have to pack up,

we've got to pack up all the garage, all the air freight, strip the cars, all of that stuff.

So I don't think we left the garage until about 4am really morning, and then we had

really, we literally had like an hour, two hours in the hotel before we left for the

airport. So I think it's probably a celebration that's just had to be like a bit of a rain

check on that one, and we'll find it throughout the rest of the year at some point.

So you didn't get to sleep? Essentially, you just got straight on the plane?

No, no, I didn't, I didn't get to sleep Sunday night. I had a shower, packed the rest of

my case, and then it was off to the airport. Yeah.

Goodness me. I mean, yeah, if ever there's proof of the hard work that goes on in Formula

1, that is it. But there must, I mean, there must be some good parties at Red Bull. There

will be, I'm sure, right? There'll be a celebration of what Max and you've achieved.

I think that like the teams always had, it tends to sort of be an ethos of work hard,

play hard, you know, which is what we do. We push the limits at work, we do everything

we can. And then, yeah, we're lucky, you know, as an employer, Red Bull are brilliant at

sort of knowing how to celebrate. And at some point, yeah, we will have a celebration and

we do throughout the year. Yeah, is it, Milton Keynes is going to go wild?

Where's the celebration going to be? I'm sure that they've got things planned for

the factory as well. It's not just us at the circuit. I'm sure everyone gets an opportunity.

Let their hair down and sort of enjoy the achievements.

I'm intrigued and you don't have to answer this. Do you get a bonus when you win?

We do, okay. We get a bonus from the Constructors' Championship. Yeah.

And then obviously, there are various little bonus schemes for like race victories and

things like that. Yeah. That's pretty exciting, isn't it?

It's nice. Yeah. I mean, look, I was going to sit here and say, oh, it's not nice to get a bonus.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, of course it is. Yeah. And I guess that really helps the team all

kind of move forward as one. I guess everyone's getting a bonus right across the whole structure.

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, for sure. So, yeah, I don't think it motivates you anymore purely

because you're motivated to win. I've always said that people who work in the sport,

they're there because they love racing. So, regardless of that, I feel like the people

who have chosen to be here anyway, they're already motivated. Yeah.

But it is obviously nice to get a nice... No one's saying it's not nice to get a bonus.

No, I'm saying it's not nice, for sure. Bring on the bonus. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaking of winning, let's talk about this season just as a whole because some of the

records that Max and the team have broken this year are insane. 10 wins in a row for Max this

season, 14 wins in a row for the team and you've won 26 out of the last 28 races.

That is just utter domination. And then I saw that you put up an Instagram post,

you said, I've never seen anything closer to perfection than what Max Verstappen has achieved

this year. Tell me about that perfection that Max has achieved.

Well, I mean, it seems to be his nature that he will just chase every last bit,

he'll leave nothing on the table. And like I said, it's great to have. It puts the pressure on us

to make sure that we deliver, which is great. And the nature of the people in the garage,

we thrive on that pressure. It's what drives us. We want to be the best every single week.

But yeah, watching what Max has done, week in week out and having the sort of knowledge that

every week I know that as long as we do our job and the car is reliable and it does what he needs

it to do, I know he's going to deliver. So it's just one of those things. You go into a race weekend

and it's nice because, and I've always said this, it doesn't matter where you are in the pit lane,

it doesn't matter what garage you are, you are doing the same hours. Everybody's working such

long hours, you know, like you're even like, you know, Saturday or Sunday can be 16 hour day easily.

So it's nice to know that you've got everything in place that you've put yourself in the best

position to get a result from that work. And what's Max like to work with? Million dollar

question, I'm sure you get asked it a lot. But what's it was he like? I do know what,

I've always thought this is odd to me that people can't see sometimes how brilliant he is.

Like, and like for me, like as when he's in the garage, when he's not in a race car, he's one

of us, you know, like he really is like, you know, he engages with us just as you want any of your

other colleagues to engage with you. He's kind, he cares about the people around him.

And it's brilliant. And I like the fact that he can get into the car and close his lid,

and then he should be ruthless. You know, you're a sports person, we're here to win,

he's here to win. And I think it's great that he's able to switch between the both. And he

really does. Yeah. He, I mean, you've worked with quite a few drivers in your time. I mean,

you've been at Red Bull since 2015. Yeah. So you've worked with a few other drivers. What

attributes does Max have? And in terms of working with, I mean, you've worked with Riccardo,

you've worked with Kavya, you've worked with Gasly, Albonne. What are their kind of traits?

What do they all share? And maybe what are the differences between some of them?

I mean, I think, where I think Max is probably different to most of the others is that Max over

the years has managed to encompass so many of the great attributes of the drivers that we've

seen before. Like Max, when he arrived in F1, it was clear that he had this raw, unbridled talent,

you know, like this raw speed. And then over the years, he's just grown and grown,

and he's added everything to his, to his arsenal. You know, like his, his race management, his,

his way of seeing the holistic picture, like his, his determination, you know, like all of these

things, you know, are what's put him in the position that he's in now, you know, it's, it's

a way that he's been able to encompass so many things that so many great drivers have had,

and bring them all together to make them work. Like when you see an athlete in their prime,

in their absolute prime, you know, you look at them and you say, that's a package that right

now no one can beat, you know, and it's, and that's what it is, you know, so many drivers,

they saw their prime. And I think when you're an athlete in that position, it's your job to try

and stretch that out for as long as you can and stay in that, that zone, that little window

of perfection. And that's what Max is able to do right now. He's just be able, he's just able to

just extract everything from himself. And it's, it's, it's amazing to see up close. It really is.

Yeah. I mean, I'm jealous that you get to see behind the seat. I mean, obviously we only see

the stuff on the, on the television, but I'm sure a lot goes on behind the scenes that we

don't see. And yeah, it must be amazing to be, to be up close and talking about the car then for

this year. Obviously it's the RB 19 has been an incredible car so far. It was there a point

in the season where you were in hold on a minute. This is a, this is a good car. We, we might be,

I mean, obviously up until Singapore, you know, it was likely you were going to win every race

this season. I think we kept asking Christian, I think he started getting a bit annoyed with Skye.

I don't like talking about Singapore. It upsets me. It was a bad week.

Yeah, but, but there was a genuine chance you were going to win every race this season.

And that, just even saying that as a sentence, when we're talking about a race like Singapore

so far into the season is crazy. But, but yeah, when did you start to go, this is a pretty,

pretty good car? You know what, it wasn't, I remember looking at the beginning of the season,

the first time we fully assembled the car, getting it ready for one of our like filming,

filming days before we, we went off to testing and I looked at it and I thought, that looks

racy. Yeah. You know, that's, you know, it looks fast, but you just never know. And then you sort

of go through testing and obviously teams are never going to show their true pace through

testing. You know, everyone's running through their own programs, but as far as we were aware from,

from what we knew about our car, we were looking all right and everything was as expected. And,

and then it, you know, Bahrain, you get to the Bahrain race and you come home with a one, two,

and you're like, this is great. This is a good, this perfect start. But then it probably would

have been maybe two or three more races before you really thought, wow, you know, we've, we've

really made something. We've really, really built something here that's going to be, you know, able

to challenge for wins all year. And, and at first it was, you know, for us, we always see it as,

it's a challenge. You know, I don't know, you know, maybe from a fan perspective, you look and you

think, oh, well, Red Bull going to win, like it's never that view going into a race weekend. It's

always like, right, this is the challenge this week. We have to be on top of our game because

the moment you're not, somebody's going to snatch that from you. So yeah, that's why I don't like

talking about Singapore. It, like, you know, for me, it's, it's, it doesn't, it doesn't detract

from what we've done this year. But, you know, I went into, you know, by the time we were midseason,

you know, I've decided, I've said to myself, you know what, I want to win every single race,

you know, and that's the mentality. And I still do now, you know, we've got five more races to go

this year. I want to win every single one of them. So that, that sort of, that sort of knowledge

that the car was going to be that good didn't come till later on. But yeah, once, once we

realised it was quite a, quite a wonderful thing. And as pit crew, are you, are you looking up and

down the pit lane in Bahrain in testing, for example, at what other teams are doing? Do you,

do you look at the Mercedes at testing and go, wow, that looks very different to what,

to what we've got here. I wonder who's right. Certainly, certainly at the beginning of 2022.

Yeah. Of course. Yeah. I remember first seeing that Mercedes car and thinking, oh,

have they, have they done it again? Have they found something that no one else has found?

And then you talk to our own designers and engineers and they're like, no, no, we're happy,

we're happy where we are. And they sort of put your mind at ease a little bit. But obviously,

until, until the time start coming in and the race results, you know, you're never sure.

And then the beginning of this year, it was sort of, I guess, a little bit of relief that you'd

seen that a lot of the teams had sort of started to follow the path that we were already following.

And that sort of gives you a bit more confidence and say, okay, we were on the right path,

we're fine, we can keep building from here and keep building. So during testing, you sort of,

you do look at other teams, but you, you take it all with a bit of a pinch of salt because

you know that nobody's, nobody's going to be out there showing their true pace. Obviously,

if teams have a really bad testing with reliability and things like that, then obviously, you pay

attention to that because reliability is reliability. You can either run the car or you can't.

But in terms of outright pace, I don't think you look at other competitors in, in testing and say,

this is worrying me or whatever. I think you have to wait until you get into that first

race weekend and when everyone's cards are actually on the table.

Yeah. And people are running different fuel loads and all sorts of things.

Yeah, that's it. I mean, you might, you might go out there and stand in the pit lane and watch

other teams do pit stop practice. Yeah, right. It's a nice little mind game. You know, they know

you're watching and you'll be like, Jürgen Klopp pretty much is the other team born up.

People did it to us for so long, like, you know, for years, you know, there'd be team bosses from

other teams, you know, McLaren, whatever, they'd come down the pit lane, they'd look at us and

they'd watch our practice. And I think on the one hand, obviously, they might have been trying

to learn and improve their own. But also on the other hand, there's definitely that little bit

of I'm just going to go and stand right there and watch them and see if I can distract them.

Yeah. I was going to ask you about the pit stop because this weekend,

you lost the world record for the fastest pit stop. How annoyed are you with McLaren?

I'm not annoyed at McLaren. I'm not annoyed at McLaren at all. They have done a fantastic job.

You know, like that's the thing about the sport. It doesn't matter where you're at,

there's always someone chasing you. You know, those guys have worked super hard on their pit

stops. They've put in the hours, watched you. Well, I'd like to say we've inspired them.

But that's it. They've done an amazing bit of work. So not annoyed at McLaren at all.

On the other hand, I would very much like it back. I think that I imagine that all of my

colleagues feel the same way. So now it's just a case of, you know, get your head down, get

practicing and let's see if we can get it back to where we believe it belongs. 1.7. This is it.

It's just insane. That's what we need. Crazy. Do you know what? It's an impressive feat from them

because obviously the wheels are heavier. You know, the wheels are heavier there. There are

there have been changes to the way that you can do a pit stop. I know that we are capable of beating

that. And it's just about, like I said, with a pit stop, you've got 16, whatever, 20 people

that all have to do their job perfectly within that two second window. You know,

so many things that are needed to come together. So it will just be a case now of getting your head

down, keep practicing. We know we can achieve it. And it would just be a case of putting it all

into practice and hoping that everything comes together. My brother-in-law died suddenly. And

now my sister and her kids have to sell their home. That's why I told my husband we could not put

off getting life insurance any longer. An agent offered us a 10-year $500,000 policy for nearly

$50 a month. Then we called SelectQuote. SelectQuote found us identical coverage for only $19 a month,

a savings of $369 a year. Whether you need a $500,000 policy or a $5 million policy,

SelectQuote could save you more than 50% on term life insurance. For your free quote,

go to SelectQuote.com. SelectQuote.com. That's SelectQuote.com. SelectQuote. We shop, you save.

Full details on example policies at SelectQuote.com. Slash commercials.

Compared with 2021 and a season that was right down to the last lap of the last race.

He's a little smile there. When you look at the 2023 season and you've dominated the season,

what for you do you prefer? Do you prefer something that is down to the line and keeps the whole team

moving right to the very end? Or do you actually quite enjoy this stepping back a little bit and

going, no, we are dominating. I don't know. How do you see it as pressure?

I prefer it without the stress. Don't get me wrong, 2021 was amazing. First, just the whole

season was, and I've said this before, it was my toughest year for sure. It was stressful.

It was such hard work. And it was great to get a reward at the end of it. But if I'm honest with

you, I know that I'm still going to do the same hours and be just as focused. And it'd be just

nice to not have that stress. Towards the end of 2021, those last four or five races,

it was immense. I can't imagine what it was like for the drivers and some of the engineers.

I can't imagine what it was like for them. Because us from the garage, turning spanners

was stressful enough. Every time you went out into the pit lane, you knew that the consequences

would be so severe if you messed one up. It's nice to be able to operate with a little bit less

of that pressure. But was that the mindset then? Especially in a pit stop where you go,

God, if I don't get this right, that could be the world championship. Gone for Max.

Yeah. I think whenever we step out in the pit lane, we recognise the importance of what we're

about to do. You can't let that pressure hamper you. You have to just say to yourself, right,

I know the skill. I've got the muscle memory. I've done this hundreds and hundreds of times.

So really, in your mind, it's just about being able to put the circumstances out of your head.

Because ultimately, the circumstances don't matter. Performing the skill is what matters.

And if you do what you've practised, it's going to be fine. If you let things like the circumstances

get into your head, it only makes the job harder. If I'm thinking about the fact that

another team is boxing next door to me, and that we're going to have a race down the pit

lane, if I'm worried about that race, the chances are I haven't got my full focus on

hitting that wheel now. So when I actually step out into the pit lane, my focus becomes very

narrow. But yes, there is obviously always an awareness in that sort of situation that if you

do have a shocker, as we call it. Well, if you do have a shocker, then the chances are that

the repercussions are going to be quite severe. And no one wants to be the person that sort of

be seen to be the one that screws that up. Yeah. And what's so interesting, I find with that side

of the sport, it's not just you, it's not just the guy next to you, it's all of the people around

the car, all have to be on the level that you've just described. And if one person is off, the whole

pack of cards falls down. And that's what I find so remarkable about a pit crew.

Yeah, that's it. You know, when you think of it, a car's going to drive towards you at 60 kilometers

an hour, which is quite quick. Yeah, people forget that. It's going to stop in a white box

that's only the same size as said car. Yeah. And then 16 people are going to try and change

the wheels and adjust the flap in under two seconds. You know, it's quite a feat.

It's remarkable. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's one of my favorite things to do is see

all of that stuff up close. Because yeah, on TV, you just don't get a full picture and it's

the preparation and it's the, yeah, you see everyone's faces, it's game face, isn't it?

I mean, pit stops was one of the reasons why I took a huge interest in the sport.

So like I'd never, the first Grand Prix that I went to was like Silverstone in 2009.

And I was doing the pit lane walk beforehand and I saw mechanics setting up the garages

and doing pit stop practice. And that was probably one of the first goals that I set

myself when I embarked on a career is I said, I want to be on a pit crew.

You know, and then when I achieved that, I think probably was it first season was probably 2011

when I was in Russia. And then once I achieved that, the goal changes. And then it's like,

well, I want to be on a good pit crew. Yeah. Yeah. And then, you know, when I joined Red

Bull, I was like, right now I've got an opportunity to be on the best pit crew.

And then, you know, once you start those times started tumbling down, then your

goals just change. Your goals get bigger and bigger and bigger. And you say, well,

we beat the world record last year. I want to beat it again this week and this week and this

week. And that's what it's all about. It's just about the goal setting for it.

Yeah. It's incredible. Yeah. And really get really amazing description of what it's like.

So thank you. And I want to talk a little bit about the team and Red Bull and some of the

key figures. And Christian Horner, the team principal, always fascinates me. And we see

him obviously on sky quite a lot. And he's obviously on the pit wall with us sometimes. And

we see, you know, we get a great version of Christian. He gives us a lot of information.

But I'm intrigued to know how, when you're managing a Formula One team,

how does he communicate with everybody in the team? Do you have big team meetings very often?

Do you have like internal emails saying, good job, everyone? Like, how does it,

how does it work? How does he play a role in your part?

Christian does a lot of that. He does, he always, after each race, he does a debrief in the factory

for all of our factory staff, because obviously they're not all at the circuit.

In terms of us, to be fair, he's great at just walking around the garage and just

how are you, how's things going, you know, how we're looking today, you know, like things like

that, you know, for us at the circuit, we're really lucky in terms of, it's quite an open

sort of relationship. Christian just comes and he'll have a chat with you. Yeah. I think there's

obviously lots of, we use our internal comms to congratulate everybody else. And yeah, it's a

very open sort of relationship. Yeah. There's no big Zoom call on a Monday morning.

I don't know. I assume Christian spends a lot of time in his meeting.

Yeah. I always think with the two principles, when do you actually ever have time off? I mean,

there's, you know, yeah, I certainly imagine that I probably get more time off than him.

Yeah. It's a very, very busy role. And then the likes of Adrian Newey, people like that,

I mean, probably the greatest designer of Formula One cars now in Formula One history.

Do you have much relationship or do you spend much time with people like that? And

when you're working on a car like the RB 19 as it is, I mean, it must just feel amazing to be

part of that piece of Formula One history. You know, Adrian's brilliant. Like he's quite a

reserved person anyway. But when he's in the garage, it's quite funny. Like when you're in

the garage and you're working and you're busy, you can get quite annoyed if people are like in your

way. Certainly like any guests or other people that are sort of non-operational that happen to

be in the garage, you can get quite annoying when people are in your way or you're working. And

when it's Adrian, you know what he's doing. You know he's there and he's there working and you

know he's there and the chances are he's going to find a way to improve the car. So you're always

like, it's fine, Adrian. And he's really, he's always, you know, he'll be there sketching away

and you'll be trying to get work done. Really? So he's sketching in the garage?

Constantly. Really?

He's constantly writing notes, making sketches, thinking of things. That's what he does all day

long. And then you're constantly like, you'll be there and you'll be trying to get something done

and Adrian might be in your way and you're trying to work around him. And eventually he'll be,

oh, sorry, yeah, sorry, Cal, I mean, and you're like, no, no, you carry on. You carry on. You're

going to have a bigger impact on making this car win than I am. So yeah, you do whatever you need to.

That's incredible. I know that he obviously loves, he's still a drawer, isn't he? You know,

in an age of obviously technology and computer design, it's great that he's still there with

a pencil. I find that so interesting. And then in terms of, we spoke about the work hard,

play hard culture at Red Bull. But, you know, who do you hang around with? Who are your best

mates in the team? Like, what's kind of your experience of the culture of Red Bull?

To be honest, we're quite lucky. Like everyone in the garage, you know, like we're all sort of,

regardless of sort of what area you're working in, we all end up spending a lot of time together.

We try and do like loads of team events throughout the year. Like we do barbecues

places where we can and things like that and nights out. And so it's sort of very much a,

I'll spend time with pretty much anyone kind of thing. It's not, we're not sort of walled off from

one another. Yeah, it's quite lucky. Like, you know, it's very much a place of everybody has to fit

in the team. So like everybody sort of has their role, you know, we have the people that are

serious and making sure no one's doing anything stupid. Then also we have the people in the

garage who sort of just general being can lift everyone's mood. You know, there's some really

tough days, there's some long days and we're lucky we've got people in the garage who can just make

you smile. You know, when you're having a bad day, they can lift the mood of everyone around them.

And all of these sort of things are really important to have as part of the sort of community.

Yeah, I can definitely imagine this. Yeah, those people almost become as important as

anyone else. Literally, and it's not just, but it's not just your role in the garage, it's not

just your role in your job, it is just about the way you are. You know, like we're quite lucky in

that we sort of have a culture where everyone can just be them, you know, everyone can just be them

and contribute what they contribute and their sort of soft skills, if you like, you know,

like their way with people, their humor, their ability to keep everybody unified. They're all

skills that are just so valuable over the course of a long year. You know, like, especially when

you're away for like 180 days of the year, I think it is this year, something like that. And

some of those weeks can be tough, you know, like you think of even, you spend enough time with

even your best friends, you know, and if you're under pressure and you're working long days,

it could be quite easy to get sick of everyone, you know, so it's really important to have these

characters in the garage that can just sort of maybe change your perspective about something if

you're having a bad day or just, you know, even when things are bad, just make you smile. There

are days where if you don't laugh, you'll cry. Yeah. So it's important to have people that make

you laugh. Yeah. Yeah. I was hearing your dislike of house music in the garage. I honestly,

do you know, we've got a great sound system. It's brilliant. And it's not that I dislike house

music. I dislike listening to the same house music week in, week out. And especially if you're

having a bad day, like if you're having a good day, you can ignore it, you can get along with it.

But if things ain't going right, when you're really, really busy, that constant. Yeah. Oh,

my God. Oh, my God. Honestly, like there are time, there are days in the garage where I just,

I just put my headphones in. Yeah. I just put my headphones in, like whatever.

Oh, dear. I don't know if there's any house music artists listening, but please, please,

please, nothing in the Rebel garage. So your role, let's come to talk about your role specifically.

So senior power unit assembly technician, you must be asked this a million times,

but I'm going to ask it anyway. What, what, what does it mean? What, what do you look after?

Okay. So essentially, I take care of our race and test PU's. So all of like the ancillary systems,

so your cooling systems and all your pipe work, exhaust systems and all the parts that help integrate

that power unit into our chassis. So I sort of look after the build and the service of those bits,

planning for future events, making sure that we've got engines, that we've got parts we can build

them on time, make sure they're all built to the right specification, make sure they're ready to

go in the car as and when they're needed, getting bits back and forth to the factory for service

as and when they're required, and just generally overseeing and making sure that what we've got

in terms of our power unit installation is correct and as we want it. Very good summary

of what is no doubt a very complex job. And talk me through like a regular sort of race week

for you. What, how does that, how does that play out? When do you travel to the race? When

do you come home? So it kind of depends on where the race is, obviously, when you're going forwards

in time, you might have to travel a day earlier or whatever. But let's say we fly out on a Tuesday,

which is most, most races will end up flying on a Tuesday. Wednesday's your sort of first day in

the garage to build the cars. And sorry to interrupt, are you building the garage from scratch?

Right, so we, we have, I think all teams now, you have a setup crew. Yeah. So there are people

that might have flown out on a Sunday, and there'll be some sea freight that'll already be there at

the circuit with them to build the main parts of the garage. And then the air freight will arrive

probably on the Monday and whatever. We, our first day in the garage is on a Wednesday. Yeah.

And when we arrive in the garage, for the most part, the garage setup is done. We do have

garage technicians who'll be looking after the bits that need to be set up from that point onwards.

But for us building the car, yeah, Wednesday's our first day where we're,

we're just building the car, we're getting it, getting it ready for the weekend. So it's installing

the engine, installing the gearbox, doing all your pre-flight checks if you like. And then into

Thursday, Thursday's the first day you're allowed to fire the car up. So obviously all the PU's,

they're sealed by the FIA at the end of an event. And on Thursday, they'll, or Wednesday, they

normally come round and unseal them. And then we get a time on a Thursday where you're first allowed

to fire your car up. So Thursday is all of that stuff. So firing it up. And then there's getting

all the body work on and then getting the car on the setup patch, making sure it's all set up to

the setup sheet that the engineers will have sent out to us. Which is different every race.

It will be circuit-specific. So obviously there's constantly simulations going on back at home.

The drivers will spend time in the sim and then engineers will look at their start setup sheet

and they'll give you the sheet where they want the car to be for the start of the first practice

session. So Thursday is spent doing that. And then the last thing we tend to do on a Thursday is

pit stop practice, which is like our longest pit stop practice of the week. We'll run through

all the set pieces. So you run through nose changes or, you know, and you have a puncture

stop and we'll run through all of these things. So Thursday is your first chance to sort of get

your eye in in the pit lane and be ready for pit stops. And then into Friday, Saturday, Sunday,

that's where you're sort of at the mercy, I guess, of what happens, right? Yeah. I mean,

you're at the mercy of the timetable then, you know, obviously your practice sessions are as

scheduled. You do any changes that you have to do in session. And then in between sessions,

you're basically any scheduled changes. So anything that you've got that was already planned,

maybe you had test items or things like that that you need to swap for P2.

And then, yeah, it's sort of from that point on, you're just sort of nursing the car.

Yeah, you just sort of hope that what you've built is right. And you just keep checking it. Every

time you get the bodywork off or the floor off, you're just making sure that everything looks

like it's as exposed to be. You'll have any issues or potential issues reported to you.

So then you'll be investigating any of those. And then it's just a case of, yeah,

all the way up until sort of the lights go out on Sunday, you're just sort of

managing that, keeping the car. We often describe it as on life support.

In the garage, you've constantly got the water heater plugged in, you're draining and refilling

oil. More pit stop practice throughout the week in between sessions and before sessions in the

morning. And then, yeah, up until lights out, that's pretty much what it entails.

What do you prefer? Do you prefer a weekend where nothing goes wrong? It's all by the book

and everything's as predicted? Or do you prefer a weekend where you've got a crash on Friday and

you're like, oh, God, we've got to race around. But I guess that does give you adrenaline.

But I'm not the one who's preparing the car. Given the choice, I'll always take a smooth

weekend. With that said, some of the weekends we've had where things haven't gotten to plan,

I think the crew that repaired Max's car in Hungary, those are some of also our best days.

That's where mechanics technicians get their chance to really shine. I think everybody

looks back at that race and I wasn't on that crew at the time, but what that crew achieved

then, that day on the grid, it was amazing. Just in case you can't remember, 20 minutes

to change pretty much the whole front corner. And make the car safe and reliable and Max again

delivered and came home with a great result for the position we were in.

So given the choice, I'll take stress-free, but it is worth noting that those tough weekends or

those tough days, you sort of leave them with a real sense of pride. You know that you achieved

something that should have been impossible. I always think back to the year in China with

Daniel Ricciardo. And it was like during P3, we had an engine failure. And honestly,

I've never seen so many people work so well in a group to get that car out. And we got it out the

door and across the line with like a minute or something to go and qualifying for him to qualify.

He ended up qualifying P6 and then went on to win the race the next day. So it's a great story,

the fact that, you know, and honestly, there were times when we were doing that work where

even I, like I try and stay positive, but we were in a position where I genuinely thought that

there wasn't a chance we were going to complete this in time.

Was this the one where you dropped the spanner?

It was the one where I dropped the spanner. And the spanner...

I've heard this story. Well, the thing, in case anyone hasn't heard this story,

it was a tough man. Honestly, like I said, it was hot. I've never seen so many people working

around a car. Like everyone around the car, you were working with like, you know, your elbows

tucked in because everyone was in this space trying to get something built on this car to get

out the door. And your hands are slippery and I dropped a spanner and I looked at it. And as it

went down there, literally, I remember just pausing for a moment and going, well, that's not coming

back. And then, and then, you know, it got to the point where I said, I remember saying to the Chief

Mechanic, I said to him, look, just so you know, there is a spanner in there and there's nothing

I can do. I can't get it out. And he said to me, well, it's in there now. We've got to get it out

for qualifying. Let's get the car out and hopefully we can retrieve it. And we ended up not retrieving

it. And then I just sat there with my foot tapping and my hands shaking for the entire race, waiting

for, you know, something on the car to fail because I dropped a spanner. And it's one of those,

it's one of those things. It's a great story. One of my colleagues, it wasn't even my spanner,

obviously, it was one of my colleagues spanner. It's good to have you owned up then, otherwise.

Oh, no. That's actually a rule for life. And I think it's one of those things. No one,

in a situation like that, no one's going to give you a hard time for making a mistake when you're

working in those sort of circumstances. Mistakes happen. You know, I have not, I've made plenty

in the past in my career and I'm sure that I will make more in the future. I try and ensure that

it's never the same mistake. I think that's the biggest thing is to learn. But one thing you

have to do is you have to take accountability. You know, there's no, there's no point in having

an issue and just being like, well, I don't know, it doesn't help anyone. You don't learn from it.

And the tier, you know, you can't introduce anything to prevent it happening again, if no one's

willing to just take some accountability. Like I said, these things happen. You know, I'd much

rather make a mistake and be able to put my hand up and say, do you know what, this is, this has

happened than everybody chasing something that doesn't exist because no one wants to talk about

it. And that's the culture, I guess it's created. Red Bull, that's all part of it, isn't it? If you

created a culture where everyone was scared to own up to stuff like that, you'd probably have a very

different. Yeah, exactly. It would change the entire dynamic of everyone working in the garage.

I think all of us accept that we're, you know, we're not perfect. You know, we aim for it every

single week. We will strive for perfection. I don't think there is such a thing in motorsport,

because it's something that moves forward so quickly. But yeah, you have to have a culture

where people can just be open about things that go right, things that go wrong.

And then, and then your, your sort of social media profile, I don't know how that kind of came

about. Just tell me how, how that all started, because last check this morning, 175,000 followers,

which I think is probably the most, probably the most followers in the pit lane,

apart from drivers maybe, or team principles. I was going to say, I think a few of the drivers.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, fine. Charlotte Clare and Nando Doris aside.

They're much better looking than before, so I can understand. But yeah, how did that come about?

I guess it sort of started with, probably with Drive to Survive. I think obviously with the

paddock, not being the most diverse workforce, it's, you sort of, I tended to stand out anyway,

and Drive to Survive sort of exacerbated that. And then, and then I think, I think at first,

I didn't really have that much interest in it. But then what happened was, as sort of followers

grew, loads of people, so many people started contacting me. Firstly, just loads of young

people contacting me saying, you know what, I love seeing your passion and seeing your energy on the

screen, and I'm really interested in motorsport, and asking for advice and things like that. And

at that point, it sort of was like a realisation that actually, you know, it's great. I love,

like I spent yesterday in a school talking to young people about possible careers, and I love

doing that. I love talking to young people about the opportunities that are available.

And then the other thing was, I got so many messages from young black kids in schools,

and people that looked like me saying, you know what, just to see somebody working in that environment

who looks like me, has sort of made me realise that I could do that too. You know, and representation's

so important. And whilst, you know, I never consider myself necessarily a role model,

but I do think with the experience I sort of have in the industry, I have a responsibility to try and

help other people that want to pursue these careers. I'm a huge advocate for how amazing

these careers can be, and you know, I consider myself so lucky to have travelled the world.

So, when people contacted me and they were saying, look, you know, I just love seeing you,

or my son loves seeing you, or my daughter's really, really amazed at seeing you every week.

She looks out for you on the telly. It sort of just became more of like, I felt like I had a

responsibility to try and engage with people. And obviously, once you start engaging with people,

and people realise that there's other voices out there in F1, and people that they can really

relate to that are involved in the sport, then it just sort of, the following grows from there,

and then you get more opportunities to do this stuff, and it just all sort of snowballs.

Yeah. And that role, I was going to ask you, well, who your role models were in Formula One,

did you look up to anyone and go, I want to be like them?

Well, this is the thing, when I started out racing, or when I decided I wanted to have a

racing career, obviously, we had Lewis fresh off the back of his first world championship.

And that was great. It was amazing to see that, you know, people who looked like me

could break into a sport that traditionally people like me hadn't got involved in.

So that was great. But I also understood that I wasn't going to be a race driver. I don't have the

talent. I don't have the talent. I think I'm too tall for it. And I'm certainly not willing to put

the hours in the gym to lose the kilos that I'd have to. Very honest. Which is the reality of it.

But, you know, once I sort of discovered that there were engineering careers to go and work in

these garages and do these things, there was very few. Like, when we look at the Formula One

paddock now, especially in the last three, four years, it's changed dramatically. And we are seeing

some amazing faces, amazing people that are doing great work in the paddock and inspiring more.

But when I started out, when I first embarked on it in 2009, and certainly in junior formulas,

it wasn't, you know, I don't think I worked with another person who looked like me until 2015,

probably until I joined Red Bull. So it wasn't like there were loads of people that I could

look to for representation. Thankfully, I was really lucky in that I just had some great

role models that I met once I began. You know, like I pursued it anyway, I didn't really let

that discourage me. And thankfully, when I got there, I then met some great people who inspired

me to push on. You know, like I always think about one of my first chief mechanics when I was doing

GP3, like Paul Bellringer, who was brilliant. He's like, you know, my race dad, you know,

he taught me all of the little things that I needed to know at the beginning of my career,

all of the little things that I still sort of think about now and I carry with me when I'm

working now. And that's what I say to people, I get that there's not that much representation for

you now, maybe in technical roles, but you will meet some people that will inspire you, you know,

you just got to sort of give it a chance and you will, you will meet some people that inspire you.

And if I can be one of them, and that's great. Like, I love that, that's brilliant.

Yeah. And how important has Lewis been in getting, and I think from my point of view,

what Lewis has done amazingly well at is getting people interested in not just being a racing

driver. He's all about the STEM subjects and getting kids, you know, any kid just interested

in knowing, actually, in Formula One, a bit like you were saying earlier, there's all sorts of roles,

there's the engineering and technical roles, but there's also marketing and so forth,

and I think Lewis has done a really good job of that. Do you agree? Do you think that he's been

is an icon, you know, at the end of the day? Lewis, for me, that for me, that will always be

his greatest achievement is what he does for the industry and for the sport in particular.

You know, like he used his platform and it's so important, you know, people with platforms use

them well. And he really did, he embraced it and he used his platform to firstly get the conversation

started because that was the biggest thing. When I first started, there just wasn't a conversation

about it. You know, I talked to my colleagues at the time and they say, Cal, you know, why

no black people ever interested in racing, you know, and that was it. That was one of the biggest

barriers was that people just didn't have awareness of the careers and Lewis getting the

conversation started. And obviously, the Hamilton Commission report, it did two things. It made

people who weren't previously aware of these careers, aware of them, but then also it gave

the sport and the industry a starting point to sort of say, yeah, look, because the sport has

always recognized that there's been a lack of diversity, you know, it's not like it's not like

it was some big secret that was only discovered in 2020. This is something the sport has always known,

but I think from a lot of from a lot of situations, businesses and areas and sectors in the sport,

they didn't really know why there was a lack of diversity. So the Hamilton Commission report

was really important in providing firstly data sets so that the industry could see where it was

right now. Because I know that in the past, loads of journalists had tried to sort of ask

teams and businesses this question about, you know, what is diversity like? And I think a lot

of the teams simply didn't have the data. They didn't they didn't know. So the report was really

important in that it it provided that base set of data to say, look, this is this is where we're at

in terms of, you know, compared to our population and the makeup of the population, this is where

we're at as an industry. And then teams were able to say, okay, fine, now we know where we're at.

And then the commission went on to make suggestions and how it can break down these barriers that

are preventing it from currently being diverse. So the report and Lewis's influence, you know,

it was it's a game it was a game changer, you know, like, and I know he spent a lot of his own

money to fund independent research into it. And then he used his massive platform to promote it.

And it's certainly I've certainly seen a change in the conversations and sort of

the way people think about it. And also just giving people an understanding that it's

it's about providing opportunities to those who currently don't get them.

And if you I mean, you mentioned in terms of the the data and the changes that have been made

there, but have you noticed a tangible difference in the paddock in the last four years?

What I have noticed is the growth in the programs that are going to make long term change,

because that's what I've always been an advocate for is is long term change. Like, you know,

I'm not going to be in this paddock forever. I know that, you know, some of the other

some of the other mechanics and technicians from more diverse backgrounds, they're not going to

be in the paddock forever either. So there's no point just employing someone to fill a role.

We need to educate people so that more people are applying for these jobs, you know, there's a

short term solution is exactly that. You know, so when we see these programs who are promoting the

education, you know, engineering and schools, I want to see, I want to see all these programs

that are sort of going to reach out to people and say, look, these are the careers, these are the

long term and these are the long term solutions to sort of changing the makeup of the paddock.

But that's where I've always sort of tried to focus my energy.

And do you think F1 are doing enough? Do you think enough is being done just generally

across the paddock? Or do you think there's still a long way to go? There's still more

that needs to be done? I mean, we're not there yet. No, of course.

But like I said, I don't think this is something you can expect to see an overnight change in.

I think if you could, you could manufacture an overnight change, but it wouldn't be a

lasting one. So I think we have to give the industry time to implement a lot of the recommendations

that were made from the Hamilton Commission report. And we need to give the industry time

to make these changes work for the long run. It's such an interesting conversation. And yeah,

I mean, your profile and what you've done on social media has been incredible.

And yeah, I imagine it's probably a bit overwhelming now in terms of the amount

of people that probably message you asking for advice. And I mean, yeah, look, I sit here and

I'm happy to do podcasts like this, because it's another resource that I can send people

to go and listen to, you know, and talk about the way that I got to where I am now.

Just some of the basic information is what people are asking for.

Yeah. Yeah. How do I become a mechanic?

Yeah, that's it. Is there a career change on the table? Maybe I could do it. I don't know.

Probably not. Probably not. Just before we let you go, we've got five races left.

You said it earlier. You want to win every race. What are you hoping for?

For the next five races, what's the focus? What's the target?

I mean, exactly that. I want every pole position. I want every fastest lap.

I want to win every race. That has to be the mentality.

I think we're seeing the rate that obviously, like it seems like McLaren have improved this

season. I think that the moment you take your foot off the gas, somebody's going to snatch a win from

you. You know, the moment you drop the ball or you just let something slide or you spend one

minute just being a little bit too relaxed. And the house of cards starts to fall down.

So yeah, it's one of those things. The mentality can't change just because

you know, just because both championships are done, the mentality's got to be exactly the same.

And Austin, Mexico, pretty good locations, right?

Yeah, I love it. Honestly, Austin's a bit of a, I guess it's a paddock favourite.

Yeah, yeah. It's a party city, you know. Everybody enjoys their self in Austin,

Mexico. I love the atmosphere. Certainly at the track in that stadium section,

the atmosphere is like something else. You've got some like amazing race fans.

Yeah. They love racing. So it's always good to go to.

And Vegas. And Vegas. I've not done Las Vegas. I've never been to Las Vegas. Some of my colleagues

that have said it could be a wild weekend. We'll see how it goes.

It's going to be difficult to keep everyone under control, right?

I'm glad that that's not my problem. I have to keep myself under control. I'm capable of doing

that. I'm just going to worry about me. Yep. There you go.

Callum, thank you so much for coming in. Really appreciate your time.

Thanks for having me. Congratulations on this season as well,

because obviously it's been a remarkable season.

We're going to be back next Tuesday with Nico Rosberg. So I hope you can join us then. Bye for now.

Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.