Vinohradská 12: The First Online War

Já jsem Matěj Skalický, a to je Čekradia News Podcast, Vynohradská 12.

It's Sunday, March 26.

Hi Roman, thank you for joining us.

Yeah, thank you for the invitation.

Can we call the war in Ukraine the first social media war? What do you think?

I think so, because the amount of pictures and videos that we're getting from the frontline is enormous.

And it's not only from the soldiers, but also from CCTV cameras, from drones.

And I do agree that this is the first war that we are watching online.

It's like, you know, I hate to say it, but it's like a reality show.

Every morning you wake up and you look how Ukrainian drones are destroying Russian tanks.

And we've never seen something like that before.

So if we can name or call the war in Persian Gulf the first live television war,

so now we can call the war in Ukraine the first social media war?

Absolutely, I do agree.

And what do you think about the Russian invasion of Ukraine being different from other conflict zones or wars in the past?

Well, personally, I covered the war in Georgia in 2008.

And of course, the war in Ukraine is completely different in many ways and aspects.

Well, first of all, the number of the war crimes committed by the Russian army is insane.

If there is one place in Ukraine which has come to symbolize the barbarity of this war, it is Butcher.

This is a place where dark acts were committed, civilians tortured and killed.

Ukraine's president Zelensky has accused the Russian forces of committing genocide.

Local police chief has said that more than half of the dead were shot in what's been described as an execution.

As far as I understand, it's not only in comparison with Georgia, but with other wars as well.

For instance, we were talking to the investigators from the International Criminal Court.

And they are telling us that they have never seen, I mean, one of them, you know, the head of the working group that is investigating the war crimes.

He told us that he had never seen so many war crimes.

He told us that he had never seen so many war crimes committed by one army in one country.

And we're talking about assassinations, rapes and many other horrible war crimes.

Sorry, by the way, you're documenting the war crimes. Am I right, aren't you?

Yeah, we are the only media outlet that was not only able to document some of the war crimes,

but also talk to the soldiers, Russian soldiers, who had committed these crimes.

And one of them even confessed to us to killing a civilian in the Ukrainian village, one of the Ukrainian villages in Kyivské region.

And by the way, he was recently prosecuted by the Russian court and he received five years of postponed sentence.

But not for killing a civilian in Ukraine, but for spreading so-called fakes.

As far as I think that you know that after the start of the full-scale invasion, Russian authorities adopted a number of censorship laws.

And one of them is a law about so-called fakes, which actually for the whole world means a law about the truth.

So if you write the truth about the war in Ukraine, you can be sentenced in Russia.

So this guy, this soldier, he was prosecuted for actually confessing to committing this horrible war crime.

So this is one of the main differences, the number of the war crimes, i.e. in comparison with, for instance, the war in Georgia that I covered.

The scale of the war is also completely different.

This is probably the biggest war in Europe after the World War II.

And the front line is huge and we see fights in Bakhmut, we see fights in other churches of Ukraine.

And also, of course, what is completely different is the way the Russian media is covering the war.

I don't only mean the propaganda, which is terrible in Russia, but also the independent media that had to live Russia and is now forced to report from exile.

This is something that we didn't face before as well, I mean in Russia.

So there are many, many differences.

And yeah, it's a very big challenge for us as journalists and for the whole world as well.

We will go through them all, but let's focus now on a social media.

Are you surprised by the amount of videos and pictures and posts from Battlefield?

I'm not, because this is our life today. Everybody has a cell phone, everybody has a camera, everybody can do videos and photos.

And drones are so popular and so heavily used in Ukraine.

And that is why we are seeing so many videos from drones and also CCTV cameras.

Video is everywhere, it's around our life.

And I'm not surprised that we see so many of them in the social media or in the media.

And do you think that the social media had impacted the way people from the western countries perceive the war?

Because you'll be joining Radio Days Conference in Prague in the next days with a presentation related to social media coverage of innovation.

So this is why I'm asking you this.

Well, yeah, of course, I think that the amount of...

I mean, video played a very important role in this war in terms that it persuaded many world leaders that they need to support Ukraine.

For instance, if you look at those videos from Butcher where you see how Russian tanks or armored vehicles or soldiers are killing civilians and you see it online,

there is nothing else you need to prove because you see it by your own eyes.

But of course, it makes great impact.

Like when you see it, in the old times, you had to send investigators on the ground, you had to talk to numerous witnesses and still many people had doubts what was really going on there today.

People should not have doubts because they can see everything and I think it changes a lot.

It changes the perception and it helps Ukraine, which I'm very happy about.

But do you see any problems or do you have any concerns about covering the invasion on social media?

Well, for us as a traditional media outlet, the main problem is that we can't...

Since we have our standards, we will always lose to the social media.

For instance, a telegram channel of somebody can take video and post it, a video of a horrible war crime or a video about losses of the Russian army.

And they don't care.

We as journalists, we don't have rights just to take somebody's video and post it because our standards oblige us to prove that it is true.

Our standards oblige us to check, to fact check every video and sometimes it takes weeks or even more and that is why we are losing.

There were so many great stories that we couldn't publish because we couldn't prove them.

On the one hand, yes, it's great that we are having so many pictures and videos that help us document the war crimes and everything else related to the war.

On the other hand, there are so many fakes and people don't know how to distinguish between the facts and fakes.

And yes, when it comes to the Western audience or to the Ukrainian audience, it may be not such a big problem.

But when it comes to the Russian audience, we see what is the disadvantage of this attitude.

Because people, the readers, the viewers, they don't distinguish between the facts and the fakes and they watch these videos that are spread by propagandists and they don't even ask themselves questions whether it's true or not.

By the way, you've already highlighted that these are hard times for press freedom in Russia, so is there any press freedom left in the Russian Federation?

All the major independent media outlets had to leave Russia, those which were not closed, because since the start of the full-scale invasion, Kremlin blocked every single independent media.

So the majority of independent journalists had to leave Russia. There are still some journalists and freelancers left in the country and they are very important to us because we want to get pictures from the ground, we want to talk to witnesses and that is why we are working with freelancers a lot, which is very dangerous for them.

By the way, we are officially proclaimed in Russia as an undesirable organization.

All my reporters, by publishing articles on our website, can be sentenced to four years of prison.

Every reader who reposts, I sublime it, who reposts the story, whether it's Facebook or Instagram or any other place, can be sentenced to four years of prison as well for cooperation with an undesirable organization and every person who donates to us in Russia can also be sentenced to four years of prison.

In Russia, objecting to Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine, become at a very high price or rather a very long sentence.

One by one, Russia's independent media outlets have been forced to shut down since the start of the Kremlin's invasion of Ukraine.

Under a law passed last year, journalists in Russia can be jailed for up to 15 years for reporting what the Kremlin considers fake news about what its military is doing.

You can't read, you can't donate, you can't post, which for the majority of media outlets would mean the end.

Když jsem pročlým dělávala organizáci, když jsme děláváme, že jsme nezvěděli, že jsme všechno větkáváme a vidíme, že budoucí je zvědět, a děláváme, že jsme všechno větkáváme, který je velký.

Ale to je tak, že jste větkává, když jste větkává z větkávou, když jste nezvěděl, když jste nezvěděl, když jste nezvěděl.

Je to tak, že děláváme, který je velký. Když jste větkává větkáváme, když jste nezvěděl, když jste nezvěděl.

A nevím, že jste větkáváme.

A je to asi větkává, že jste nezvěděl, když jste nezvěděl, když jste nezvěděl, když jste nezvěděl.

Ne, ne, ne, ne, ne, ne, ne, ne.

He was talking on the phone with somebody, and was saying that, he doesn't like the war, and

the war is a crime.

And then the guy he was talking to field the complaint, was investigating PR Media and

now this guy is also persecuting..

For just mentioning on the phone that he doesn't like the war.

So it's insane, you can't call it the war.

All the media outlets are blocked.

People in Russia can watch without any problems, without any risk, only propaganda.

ale je to bl 작ost.

Je to tvůjnu media outline,

tvůjnu mediate Doug Rusche,

kteréizon se přijde u sal Hungarian.

Bre loads investigating before the war,

jen neburnto o dnes,

tak designed bylo máto z Burning Man U officiales

a to návno jaw v Lodě,

jou co světě třeba takovým trafíc

aampak z ráni o asso skinterinu.

A to São d PUBG z 뉴�ci Fermo,

z Moranovsání,

do Jezia sto consigo organizat dáme

od Jenk cos reuse represented.

Kdy p ale,

nemyslem z vězdu zakada

a to se samozřejm té blravelány.

еты to Újs 4 4 5 z

když jste zvukovat dělává informácie na ráště.

Je to, když jste zvukovat Facebook a Telegram.

Facebook je největně největně zvukovat.

Je to, když Facebook vytvořil všechny algorytmy.

A tady je to, když Facebook největně největně zvukovat

a zvukovat ráště a zvukovat ráště.

Je to, když je to všechny ráště.

Je to, když jste zvukovat na Facebooku,

a zvukovat ráště i zvukovat ráště.

M okravedek Zucrová Také je městí él maternalNak raidslapové vectorice.

Ma bitesDAY

Serióš VRL處.

sag迷 какойbychерж

a to, co jsme všechno dělali, jsou v Russia než nezvědětámi v VPN,

protože měli mít všechno na mětěch webchávů.

Ale to jsme měli, co jsou všechno, co jsou všechno, co jsou plátforms,

a to jsou všechno dělali, že je to než bloká.

To je telegram, který je náš nejvědětá na ráště, a to je YouTube. Já jsem nevěděl výděván, nevěděl jsem na tvůj station a tvůj channel,

který je můj můj koleg, který je na ráště, ale jsme věděli, že je to jedna z nejvědětáů a nejvědětá na ráště,

že je to jedna z nejvědětáů a nejvědětá.

Vždyš, že vždyš všechno dělali z nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů a nejvědětáů.

Penicinqué mohou dostaněj, že někdo scale já nevisk dostane, ale jenc d Vejfallenek dův astующil si, huisvejí tuto님 znamené bylo vypotný

nejukřímě štělecké trafné tom jen coloureds moi pak, foam in neopravené správině oprav handicraftí

na most popular news from your region.

A znova, konty vigoraiston

dat

n heavy

.

a než se to připravit, že když se všichni výzdy,

to musíte vědět, že když se výzdy,

to musíte vědět, že když se výzdy,

to musíte vědět, že když se výzdy,

protože výzdy je návodné

a připravit toho připravit.

A my jsme vytvořili toho,

jsme vytvořili Google,

ale takhle je to výzdy

výzdy, jak v dnech,

takže nic než vytvořilo.

Výzdy je výzdy,

že výzdy je výzdy,

takže než výzdy,

že výzdy, že vytvořili toho,

ale to je výzdy.

A takhle je výzdy,

že se to připravit,

že jim si vytvořilo

výzdy i Rusa.

A jak se na Instagram a sociální místí

se vysvědá v Rusě?

Instagram je blog, ale je výzdy

mnou mnou než měli.

Jsme výzdy v Instagramu

mnou když se výzdy

výzdy, že se výzdy

výzdy, že se výzdy

signingily si výzdy,

že se výzdy

mnou když se výzdy

výzdy, že se výzdy

Jak je hora nicky připalooked ze řek skinově?

To vytvědiřnost pro kde vysičil nauskat

vysičně pistol našli je

icer slovašal pěk Anthonyァ

sva constitutionalní dupy

a to je velký a to je dobré odpětě a děláte, že se vzláváte jedno independentno-Rusí na hřádnou,

a mě se vzláváte, že jsem tady přijedný při těchto, a je to vždyště.

Než jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává.

Než jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává, že jsem vzlává.

Vzláváte na podob

You can see the different approaches of these channels, because you see the independent media channels.

everything that we post or credible Ukrainian media outlets, everything is fact based

meaning that everything that we write, you can fact check.

Yeah, you can fact check it to yourself right.

As we say, what is the source of information and you can see whetha the source is credible or not

cultivation of journalism, if you look at propaganda

která česná realizace na dez специál Payd's appelec,

coby金 i dva entertainice v klasi1

a cooperative distrib curv

k tomu, kde viem neformálně Pioneer,

na tom, elicky, kde Sriju,

to bude mu supporterit semf ne bides ne renovactí a vzgleda Praise

wirejteré takhle Canada,

když vydez Marine,

cálice, kvíci to všechno o preč hoodnou praktice

folded'

pårná...

krásně...

je nightmare

roads

z Old scenik Cháci

A to je všechno za dnes.

Vyspokal jsem Roman Anin,

zvukování Indipendentou Média Outleta i Stories.

Vyspokal jsem Roman Anin,

Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.