Global News Podcast: Mideast Special: Israel escalates military action in Gaza

Hello, this is the Global News podcast from the BBC World Service with reports and analysis

from across the world. The latest news seven days a week. BBC World Service podcasts are

supported by advertising. This is a special edition of the Global News podcast from the BBC

World Service on the conflict between Israel and Hamas. I'm Nick Miles and at 13 hours GMT

on Saturday the 28th of October. These are our main stories. Israel's military operations in Gaza

have expanded. Dozens of rocket attacks hit across the strip overnight and Israel says

it's engaged Hamas fighters on the ground. Israel's war now is against Hamas, not against

Palestinian people and not against the people of Gaza. That's why Israel is making efforts to

minimize civilian casualties. Aid organizations say internet and phone communications were cut

to Gaza. So we have one million children in Gaza to whom we need urgently to get supplies,

water supplies, medicine without contact with our office and staff on the ground. It becomes that

much more difficult. There has been a significant escalation in Israel's military actions in Gaza.

It came just hours after the UN General Assembly overwhelmingly passed a resolution calling for

a humanitarian truce there. Overnight from Friday into Saturday there were perhaps the most sustained

Israeli bombardments on Gaza since the Hamas attacks on October the 7th. The Israeli army says

it's also expanded its ground operations in several parts of the strip. Daniel Hagaris

is from the Israel Defense Forces. During the night our General Security Services and the IDF

targeted killing various senior operatives of the Hamas, including a senior official who was

responsible for the preparation of the massacre. And we have continued killing various brigade

officers and others. They are literally the spearhead of the Hamas operatives.

And we see this as good progress for what we are aiming for against a much more weakened

enemy. The forces are still in the field, in the arena and continue. We have no casualties

after the activities that we carried out tonight. We're continuing to preserve the security of our

forces. Alon Levy is a spokesman for the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

He said the Israeli army was doing everything in its power to avoid civilian injuries and deaths.

Israel's war now is against Hamas. Israel's war is against the terror organization that declared

war on us on October 7th, not against the Palestinian people and not against the people of Gaza.

That's why Israel is making efforts to minimize civilian casualties despite Hamas' best efforts

to maximize them in the Gaza Strip. For example, two weeks ago, we gave Palestinians and the

northern Gaza Strip 24 hours to move out of the northern Gaza Strip temporarily for their own

safety to the south. Because in northern Gaza, that is where Hamas has embedded its terror

infrastructure under their homes, under their schools, under their hospitals.

Internet and phone communications have been cut in Gaza, and that is worrying aid organizations,

more on the humanitarian situation in Gaza in a moment. But first is our correspondent,

we're at Davis with this update from Jerusalem. Anybody who saw and heard what happened last night

will have gathered quite quickly that this was by far the biggest night of Israeli action over

Gaza, shelling and using aircraft to hit dozens, hundreds of targets in the Gaza Strip. For the

specifics, the Israelis said they hit about 150 targets, mainly tunnels, which they of course say

Hamas uses for commander control centers, for communication centers, and even for training.

They also specifically said they eliminated several Hamas commanders,

those one commander particularly responsible for aerial attacks using drones and microlights to

cross into Israel on October the 7th. So specific targets, and this is the Israeli narrative that

this is a targeted operation, it's an increased operation, it's a more intensive operation,

but these are targeted Hamas assets they are hitting. The problem of course is that

such as the intensity of the targeting, such as the intensity of the bombing,

that there is considerable collateral damage. We've now heard from our correspondent in Gaza

that according to the Hamas run health ministry, there have now been almost 8,000 people killed in

Gaza. Many of those are children, nearly all of them civilians, and the devastation on the ground

can only be, we don't really know just yet because communication with Gaza is really problematic,

but given the intensity of the bombing last night, it was a severe military operation that

would have led to many, many casualties. And where it wasn't just increased bombing activity,

there were land incursions as well. Yeah, this is a very important point as well. Of course,

we'd seen limited land incursions about three times this week, once from the sea and twice

over the land border, but those were quite limited. Small numbers of tanks, bulldozers,

perhaps preparing the way for what happened last night, but last night there were a lot of tanks,

a lot of soldiers went into Gaza. There was reportedly hand to hand fighting,

perhaps even casualties on both sides. And one thing the Israelis did say in that briefing this

morning that the, I quote, troops are still in the field and continue the war. Now, does that mean

that Israeli troops have stayed within Gaza, perhaps in advanced positions, either to mop up

after what happened overnight, or preparing these advanced positions when the tanks again will go in,

perhaps into the built up areas of Gaza, because Israel's aim, unlike previous wars,

isn't just to weaken Hamas, isn't just to give Hamas a bloody nose. After what happened on October

the 7th, Israel's stated aim is to completely wipe out and annihilate Hamas as a fighting force.

And that means the troops will have to go in, tanks will have to go in,

in a much greater number than we've seen previously. And perhaps last night was the start of that,

especially troops, Israeli troops have stayed within Gaza. Was this the start of an invasion?

Was this a limited invasion in its own right? Now these semantics don't matter,

because the intensity of the bombing from the air is having a dramatic effect,

of course, on the people of Gaza. We're at Davis. Well, at the time of recording this podcast,

most internet and phone communications are still cut to Gaza, making it very difficult for aid

agencies to contact their staff there. Jeremy Hopkins is the UNICEF representative in Cairo,

Egypt. There are several dozen colleagues of ours in Gaza working day and night to

bring assistance to vulnerable children. It was around dusk last night that UNICEF lost touch,

and we're desperately trying to reconnect with them to find out if they're safe and to continue

to support them to do their work for children. We have one million children in Gaza to whom we

need urgently to get supplies, water supplies, medicine, health supplies, and food and nutrition

supplies, and without contact with our office and staff on the ground, it becomes that much more

difficult and that much more terrifying. I mean, our hearts go out to them. They're doing, you know,

amazing work under these difficult circumstances, and now they have one more major impediment,

which means they can't communicate with us and amongst each other. The quickest way to provide

safe humanitarian support to vulnerable children is for an immediate ceasefire.

Well, for more on what's happening in Gaza, our correspondent Rushdie Abu Alouf spoke to my

colleague Anna Foster via a satellite track in Karnunis. It's about 13, 14 hours,

Gaza's without communication, without internet and without a mobile signal. The Palestinian

Health Minister just issued a statement saying that about 400 people were killed overnight in

the Israeli air strikes in the north. Israel said that they have expanded their operation,

especially in Gaza City and the north here in Karnunis. Also, there was many air strikes overnight

with about 20 people killed, about 15 targets around this area and around the middle camps.

People are really worried since the Israel is cutting all the communication. People can't

communicate with their relatives, with their friends in Gaza City and the north, and people

were really in panic. I saw people in the streets today less people in the streets than yesterday.

People are afraid of the next stage of the operation. They believe that cutting the communication,

this is the first time ever since Hamas took over Gaza and four wars before. We haven't seen Israel

completely cutting the communication with Gaza. The humanitarian situation is also getting worse

and worse with Israel not allowing food and medicine. I have seen people struggling to find water

here in the hospital. People are struggling to find fuel to run the generator and work in the

hospital. The medical crews are struggling. The ambulance services are almost shut down

since the morning. They say we don't know where to go and how to communicate with the people.

After an air strike, they wait for any news from the people on the ground and then they move

quickly to the scene and back with casualties here in the hospital. So it's a real catastrophic

situation. I'm hoping that you can still hear me. I know that you're using a satellite phone

there to hear the questions. How are you managing to find out what else is going on in the strip?

Because obviously we're at the northern end on the Israeli side and we can hear continuing

bombardment going on throughout the morning. What are you hearing about the intensification

and the impact it's having there in Gaza? Communication is extremely difficult and getting

information is extremely difficult. A lot of rumors, a lot of conflicting reporting about

what happened but we are sure from different sources in the area there is still some people who

have like Israeli mobile numbers who still could communicate. I managed to get some information

from people in the northeast and west where the the fourth area that Israel is expanding the

operation. They said they are not aware of any tanks near the like resident or the highly populated

area. So most likely the tanks are still operating within the border area one or one and a half

kilometer from the border area. But what the people are noticing is that non-stop Israeli air strike

in the area. They said this is the for the first time ever they have seen this scale of

explosion a huge black huge fire on the on the sky. Someone told local radio station here I was

listening to a local radio station. Someone said it's like a hill what's happened last night in the

north and in in Gaza. That was Rushdie Aboualouf in Gaza. In Turkey President Erdogan's political

party is hosting what it's calling the great Palestine rally in Istanbul. Mr Erdogan himself

is due to make a speech on stage where he's expected to condemn what he's already described as

the murder and madness of Israel's response to the October the 7th attacks. He's also called Hamas

not a terror organization but a group fighting for liberation. Our reporter Victoria Craig is at

the rally. There are several hundred people that have started to assemble. We're at an old

disused airport that the president frequently uses for sort of his set piece events the last

event that he held here was just ahead of the May election his final rally here in Istanbul and

this area was packed it was tens of hundreds of thousands of people gathered to hear him speak

and the AKP his party is expecting they say a million people to attend today's rally.

There's free public transport today here in Istanbul and tomorrow worth noting that tomorrow

is the centenary of the Turkish Republic so that's also designed to get people sort of

out and about to various things across the city but certainly here to the rally is you know people

are taking public buses and trains to get here. There's a steady stream of people I can see coming

in just to my left here. They're carrying huge Turkish flags lots of Palestinian flags as well

but so far the mood here is fairly calm at this hour. And yesterday we were hearing President

Erdogan was saying look Hamas is not a terror organization many Western countries including

the UK and the EU think that it is. They Mr. Erdogan saying that it's a group fighting for

liberation. What is the assessment of a lot of people in Turkey that you speak to about the

situation that are going on in Gaza? Well we've seen a lot of protests around Turkey not just here

in Istanbul but in the capital Ankara where I'm usually based and all across the country.

Shortly after the October 7th attack we saw the U.S. operations in Adana briefly closed

because of protests there. Certainly lots of protesters have gathered outside the Israeli

and the U.S. embassies those two countries really seen as sort of a united front I guess you could

say in this conflict. And so people have taken to the streets and haven't been hesitant really to

express their frustration with the situation and the crisis there. For his part the president

has said that this rally is designed to draw attention to Israeli brutality as he's called it

and support the cause of free Palestine so that's certainly the message that we're expecting to hear

from him today. With Victoria Craig well the current conflict has rekindled awareness and

passions about the Israel-Palestinian question across the Arab and Muslim world. On Friday

Arab diplomats and those from many other nations supported a UN resolution calling for a ceasefire.

Well Mike Thompson is our Arab Affairs editor. Where is the public mood at the moment across the

Arab world? I would say that very much anti-Israel in many many countries in the region over the last

24 hours we've seen widespread protests in the West Bank the occupied West Bank for instance

in Amman in Jordan something like 200,000 people on Friday joined a rally there. Also in the

Yemeni capital Sana'a in Lebanon and in Iraq and also in Iraq we've had the religious leader

Moktada al-Sadr calling for the country to close the US embassy there because of its support for

Israel. By the way Iraq of course does not recognize Israel so it's even more pointed.

And then the situation we heard there Mr Erdogan making a distinction over Hamas and what it is

and what it isn't. How is Hamas perceived? Does Hamas have sympathy amongst the public

in across the Arab world or is it specifically the Palestinians? No I think there is a lot of

sympathy for Hamas now anyway after what's been going on in Gaza. There's really little little

gray anymore a little more differentiation between the sort of things you were mentioning in the

description of Hamas and this is particularly so in countries with large Palestinian

minorities of course like like Lebanon but also in Yemen and Iraq where people talk about this

open air prison in Gaza. They talk about all the continued settlements in the occupied West Bank

attacks by settlers and also the many deaths of Palestinians at the hands of the Israeli military

particularly over the last year. And if and when we see a wider incursion

by Israeli ground troops into Gaza one has to assume that the death rate will go up amongst

Palestinians in flaming feelings yet further. Absolutely this feeling about Hamas that we

were talking about and the general anti-Israel feeling has really grown since what happened

three weeks ago the Israeli response to that and it's growing more and more intense. That was

Mike Thompson. You are listening to a special edition of the Global News podcast as we mentioned

Israel's military operations in Gaza have expanded or dozens of rocket attacks hit across the

strip overnight and Israel says it's engaged Hamas fighters on the ground. Jeremy Bowen is our

international editor and has this analysis. Well what appears to be happening is that they're

concentrating on the northern part of the Gaza Strip. There's a place called Beit Hanun and pushing

down a little bit further south from there. I've been trying to get more information out of the

Israeli army this morning and they're not adding anything to what they were saying last night

which is effectively that they are upping the tempo of their operations and people have seen

and people from just outside Gaza have filmed it this very very large bombardment. I mean you can

hear it for miles and miles around the extent of the explosions but I think right now as I

understand it the army the Israeli army is still in there that they will be trying to clear out these

tunnels. They'll probably have special forces there spotting targets for the air force.

Question mark about tanks they're more vulnerable in daylight so maybe they might pull some of those

back but I don't think we should get too hung up on definitions of all of this because I think the

assumption was when there was that enormous military buildup fully mobilized army 300,000 plus

reservists called up that there would be some kind of all-fronts invasion. I think what they seem to

be doing is to be doing it slice by slice. I think you can probably call this I don't know if it's a

very extended raid or whether it is the ground offensive but it seems very like a very large

military operation to me so without getting as I say too worked up about about what title we give

it it seems very much like a ground offensive yeah. That was Jeremy Bowen. Let us get more on the

situation on the ground in Gaza now. These paramedics are working in the southern Gaza city of

Hanunis. They describe the challenges carrying out their duties. While searching for survivors

and casualties I discovered my brother among the martyrs. This has become a part of our work as

paramedics in these circumstances. The possibility of finding my brother, my father or my wife martyred.

46 ambulances have been damaged in the Gaza Strip. 24 of those are completely out of service and the

other 22 were partially hit and have been repaired and are functional. We no longer have any body

bags in the ambulances and we're facing difficulties in transporting decomposing corpses. We're a

Davis is our correspondent in Jerusalem. I ask them to bring us up to date with the latest.

Well Israel is completely unapologetic about its operations. Of course Israel wants the world to

remember and want to remind the world that this is all about retaliating and defeating Hamas after

what happened on October the 7th when Hamas gunmen thousands of them crossed the Israeli border and

murdered killed 1400 people. Israel says that this isn't a normal operation against Hamas. The likes

of which we've seen five times over the last 15 years. This is a war in which Israel's aim is to

completely defeat Hamas and what happened overnight fits in with that narrative. Of course they've

been ridiculously heavy bombing. I say ridiculously I mean it's the highest level of bombing we've

seen every night and every day. These huge levels of explosions and bombs in Gaza prepare the way

Israel says for some form of ground offensive. Now what happened overnight that was different to

previous nights is that large numbers of Israeli troops and tanks went in on the ground into Gaza

much more than we've seen before. Not an invasion because most of them withdrew although we have

learned this afternoon that Israel did apparently leave some troops on the ground either in military

terms mopping up after the military operation or perhaps creating advanced bases so this full

scale invasion that we're expecting in the coming days might well happen. But Israel on that point

is very clear. It says it has specific military objectives. This isn't blanket bombing it says

this isn't just bombing Gaza for the sake of it. Israel says it has military objectives to destroy

Hamas tunnels, the command centers underneath Gaza city and the rest of the strip and also to

specifically target individual Hamas leaders and it said overnight it succeeded in eliminating in

Israeli terms several senior Hamas figures. So that is the the nub of the Israeli military operation.

Where you mentioned one of the main aims is to destroy those tunnels which are widespread across

particularly northern parts of Gaza. The geography is incredibly difficult though isn't it because

Israel is saying that some of those tunnels are underneath a very large hospital where hundreds

if not thousands of gardens are sheltering. Yeah that's a difficult one. Israel has maintained

for a long time that the chief for hospital which is the main hospital in Gaza well as you say we're

not only on most casualties treated there but several people have been seeking refuge there.

Israel has alleged for a long time that Hamas uses tunnels and rooms underneath the hospital

as a command center. We've seen no proof of that there was an Israeli military briefing earlier

this week which purported to show images and proof of that but these were computer generated images

they weren't actual real images of what Israel says is present under the hospital nonetheless

Israel maintains that Hamas fighters and commanders use the civilians as in effect as

as shields to protect them they live amongst the civilians which is why Israel says that

sometimes civilian areas are getting hit. Aid agencies say the net effect of all this is that

thousands of people are dying there are at least 600 if not 700 000 internally displaced people in

Gaza people who the Israelis ordered to leave northern Gaza have gone to the south and in those

areas there's still being shelved there's still being bombed there's still being killed in Khan

units for example the big town in southern Gaza in theory should be safe but it's clearly not.

That was Wira Davis. Relatives of more than 200 Israelis being held hostage in Gaza have expressed

alarm at the intensification of the fighting. A statement from the hostages and missing families

forum demanded an immediate meeting with the prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his defense minister

to discuss their safety. Nirm Sagi's mother Ada Sagi was abducted on the 7th of October after

Hamas gunmen stormed the near Oz Kubuts near the border with Gaza. Nirm grew up in the Kubuts but

now lives in London. He spoke to Michel Hussain about his reaction to the events overnight.

Exactly three weeks ago to now we're sitting sick worried with lots of messages coming from

what started to appear that happened in Israel and I think for the last three weeks 21 days

exactly we are worried since that nothing you know not knowing is a psychological torture

not hearing it's just one big void of of so many emotions. And as you watch these scenes and it and

it's clear that Israel wants to get the hostages back the question is how when you hear calls for

a ceasefire what do you think? I'm not a politician and I'm not a military guy and I think that the

only way to stop this the quickest way to stop this is to get the 229 hostages plus 100 missing

back now. But when you when you hear an Israeli official advisor to the prime minister say the

way to do that is to beef up the military operations do you support that? You know I don't know if I

can be more worried from the last three weeks and in the way that we are you know there's no

sleep and it's constantly trying to do everything in our power to bring them back home so we are

worried to I thought to the max I'm more I'm more worried now. That was Noam Sagi. Well let's take a

broader look now at the impact of the conflict. In London the city's police have revealed a startling

increase in anti-Semitic hate crimes since Hamas' attacks on October the 7th and Israel's response

to it out from 28 this time last year to 408 reported incidents. There was also a sharp rise

in Islamophobic hate crime out from 65 to 174 incidents for the period between the first and

the 18th of October. Well for London's Jews it has been an especially unsettling time. Johnny

Diamond has been to one of Britain's biggest Jewish communities to hear how life has changed

since the October the 7th attacks and a warning his report does include a smattering of language

that some listeners may find upsetting. In Stamford Hill North London Grodzinski's bakery

is bustling filled not just but mostly with Orthodox Jews here on the shelves are bagels

and rugalach, chalabread and biscuits. Once there were more than 20 Grodzinski's across London

now there are two this one run by Voldy Cooperstein. There is definitely an increase in anti-Semitism

what I see so we've had incidents where the door is open and people were just saying like abuse

you old Jews go back a friend of mine just told me that his child walked with him on the street

and then suddenly he got a slap on his face literally like that just somebody went past and

getting a slap. And Volvy as far as you are concerned this is new because there's been

anti-Semitism in London as long as there have been Jews in London but you think there has been

a significant shift since the terrible events of a few weeks ago. There's definitely be an increase

I must say as well that we have Muslim stuff and we're very happy we never had don't have no

issue with them and we have a lot of Muslim customers here and we never had an issue with them.

Customers too have tales to tell of a sharp change in me. I was going on the underground

and somebody came up to me and he said you bastard and I was scared of him because I'm a small person

otherwise I would have answered him that I have no connection to the whole thing there just like he

hasn't got connection to the other side I haven't got the connection to this side. I did see like

red pink on trees in my area it makes me a bit not safe like I feel like you know sometimes I'm

just a bit scared like you know anything can happen. You walk round Stamford Hill and I mean

apart from the fact it's a lovely peaceful neighborhood what you really notice is this

is a Jewish neighborhood in particular the number of Orthodox Jews the long dark coats and the

conservative clothing this is a place where Haradi Jews in particular are comfortable

but also very conspicuous. They've come into the playground central playground

sprayed this marquee which the children use they sprayed all these windows this this front door

and all these four windows you can see of that building. Joel Friedman is from the Pinter Trust

which speaks for Orthodox Jews we're at Lubavitch Senior Girls School in Stamford Hill. There's no

specific threats we're told by the police and security services and that is encouraging and

we're happy to see life continue as usual but we are very visible and people are very conscious

of that. Everyone can feel the stress and the anxiety just bubbling under the surface. Jewish

community has lived in Britain pretty happily and pretty successfully for decades now. Are there

times when you when you hear about abuse when you hear about attacks when you see the paint sprayed on

a school here where you think is this still a comfortable place for us to live? There's all

these things happen the community is anxious and stressed we feel very British and proud to be

British and we don't give up easily that hate and imbalance and you know that has to stop. I'm just

going to pop inside the school now to meet Rabbi Sterner who's a director and trustee of the

Vishnitz School and on the handle here there's still the remnants of the red paint that was

splashed on the doors. The girls came in the morning to saw red paint wet paint and they knew

with something bringing them not not good so basically they a lot of girls they didn't came

back to school bringing them a lot of anxieties and the teachers as well. In the Jewish community

we we have a lot of connections with the Muslim community in the area we are very close we don't

feel that because of something happened in the world between Israel and Gaza or any other issue

we don't need to suffer from it and we feel that the government need to protect us as well.

That was Rabbi Sterner a director and trustee of the Vishnitz School in Sanford Hill

ending that report by Johnny Diamond. Let's go back to what's happening on the ground in Gaza.

Israel says its troops and tanks remain in the strip after launching a major incursion

to fight Hamas. It also says the Air Force struck 150 underground targets overnight into Saturday.

The scenes in Gaza have been described as panic and chaos. Jonathan Marcus is an independent

defence analyst. It's a much bigger version of what we've seen in recent days and as far as we

know for the moment one of the big differences is that the Israeli forces haven't withdrawn on the

ground they seem to still be there and now whether this is a precursor to a sort of gradually

building up of a ground operation step by step we just don't know but as I say it's a very very

significant increase in the in the military pressure and the military operations by the Israeli

Defence Force compared with what we've seen up to now. And Jonathan remind us what Israel is trying

to achieve with this strategy and the broader picture? Well it's in a general rhetorical

sense it's trying to destroy Hamas's ability to threaten Israel in the future and we believe to

try and destroy Hamas's ability to govern the Gaza Strip. The problem is that's the rhetoric,

the reality on the ground raises more questions than are answered. How competent will the Israelis

be in dismantling Hamas militarily? How long might that take if they were to be successful

you know setting aside for a moment the the terrible human catastrophe in Gaza itself

who is going to run Gaza afterwards and it's interesting you know because the Americans

sent a very senior military team including a US Marine Corps general who's had a lot of experience

of urban fighting in Iraq and elsewhere Lieutenant General James Glynn. He went out to Israel and

all of the indications we're getting from the Americans is that they weren't hugely impressed

with Israel's military plans. They thought that they left too many of these questions unanswered.

So look we're left in a position now with three big sets of questions, four questions. How much

damage is going to be done to the civilian population in Gaza? What's the US response going to be if

this battle on the ground continues to escalate? What's going to happen of course to the Israeli

hostages and finally that fundamental concern of the Americans the fear of this war widening

with Hezbollah being drawn in on Israel's northern border and potentially in a sense Iran too and I

think that as this operation continues you know nervous eyes will be looking to the north all

the time to see what might happen there. That was independent defence analyst Jonathan Marcus.

And that's all from us for now but there will be a new edition of the Global News podcast later

on. If you want a comment on this podcast or the topics covered in it you can send us an email.

The address is globalpodcast.bbc.co.uk. You can also find us on X formerly known as Twitter

at Global News Pod. The editor of the Global News podcast is Karen Martin. I'm Nick Miles and

until next time goodbye.

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