SmartLess: “Depeche Mode”

So, that's it for this video, I hope you enjoyed it, I'll see you in the next one, bye!

You know what I started doing during the day is watching Deal or No Deal, remember that show?

Deal or No Deal, is that the one where it's like a Plinko machine?

No, Sean remind me what happened, so the library's all ran out of books.

And so you found yourself with a few extra hours to start watching Date.

No, like I'll have a suitcase one, so this is on a game show network or something?

Yes, it's on a game show network, that's exactly right.

Right, so you're just crushing great ideas during the day and then doing theater at night?

No, I can't text and type because I want to save my hands because I play piano on the show,

and so I watched some games while I had my breakfast, so I watched Deal or No Deal, remember that show?

Yeah, of course, what does breakfast look like these days right now when you're in production?

Let me guess, let me guess.

Jason, go first.

It's Eggs Benedict, because that's a breakfast with a sauce, and there used to be a sauce on every meal.

Okay, let me have a guess.

It's kind of like a sausage muffin thing, but instead of like an English muffin on the sides are donuts.

They're cut in half like a bagel.

By the way, that sounds amazing.

The sausage is just loose, good in plenties, you know, but what liquor is?

Instead of, yeah, at a restaurant, instead of like that pepper grinder, they go,

good in plenties, and they just squeeze it out.

Shawn, remember that huge, Shawn, remember that photo of you and me and Scotty with that huge pepper grinder

we were in Istanbul and the guy came over, you know, they come over and they go like,

would you like some pepper?

I can't hear about the European vacations anymore with you guys.

That was the second European trip we did.

So anyway, so Shawn and I were there, and the guy comes up, you know, they come up and go,

Who was your date, Will?

Who was my date?

Well, it doesn't matter.

I could have been your date.

We don't need to get into...

Every time we mention somebody now in the podcast, that person's like, I got 30 phone calls.

I know, they're like...

So anyway, you know the guy comes up and they go, you want some fresh pepper?

And they go, yeah, let's get some fresh pepper.

Give us a Turkish accent, Will.

And this guy, no, and this guy, do you think I want to have to write a fucking...

Your mystery guess is laughing.

A note's apology that I got to post.

His mic is hot.

It's a mail.

I got to post on my Instagram a note's apology because you prompted me to do an accent of

the guy who was my server in Istanbul.

No, thank you.

So anyway, he goes, would you like some pepper?

And I'm not, Shawn, I'm not exaggerating.

The pepper shaker was four feet long.

And two guys came out to hold it.

And two guys to hold it.

It sounds like my big bong year is back in my early 20s.

Yeah.

That used to be on my dating profile.

Takes two guys to hold it.

Listen, I have a...

All right, so listen.

Your guest is still laughing.

I know.

That's a good sign.

It's a good sign.

Wait, but you guys, I texted you one of those comments.

Did I text you both?

The comment was like a week ago and somebody wrote about my show.

No.

They said, didn't you get that, Jay?

A fat suit.

Yeah, another fucking fat suit thing.

Wait, what?

Well, somebody made a comment that Sean Davis is wearing a fat suit.

No, somebody asked me on my Instagram or somewhere, Twitter.

I don't remember.

And it was, Sean, did they...

Is that outfit that they put you in supposed to make you look bigger,

which is, you know, code for fatter?

Right.

And it's just, I'm just fucking fat.

And tell them what your friend said you should say,

no, it's supposed to make me look thinner.

Why?

By the way, Sean, it reminded me, I was watching...

I was seeing what your dating profile reminded me.

I was watching alone that show, right?

And it reminded me of something that they say in that all the time,

which is also in your dating profile, which is, hey, Bear.

Hey, Bear.

Hey, Bear.

What's up, Bear?

No, well, you know, shameless plug here, you know...

I know, you have your new show.

Yeah, have you not watched Outlast yet?

Oh, no, I want to see that.

I haven't seen it yet.

Oh, come on.

You know, I'm going to watch it.

Sean, it sounds like you've got time on your hands.

Maybe instead of dealing with no deal.

No, no, no, man.

Are you kidding?

Dude, there's 11 seasons of deal there, no deal.

He's going to get through.

What was for breakfast, by the way?

I had, yesterday I had an egg, cheese...

We don't need the full week.

A cheese egg and bacon bagel.

And then today I did good.

I did yogurt with grape nuts and blueberries.

And a banana.

And a little bit of a candy bar.

Wait, was the candy bar like a fun dip for the yogurt?

No, it was a payday.

You called that the equalizer, right?

Just to cancel out everything else.

Time for the equalizer.

It was half a payday.

Listen, you want to talk about a payday?

Our guests.

Segway, segway, segway.

Our guests.

Let me just say this.

They've sold more than 100 million records worldwide.

Wait a minute.

54 songs in the UK singles chart.

17 top 10 albums in the UK chart.

If I name a song, you're going to, I don't know,

you're going to immediately guess.

They're incredibly, incredibly talented guys

who have been just such a huge part of the music scene

for so long.

I don't want to say so many years,

because then they're going to be bummed out

and be like, what?

That makes us old.

But I will say this.

We are all legitimate fans of theirs.

None more than Sean and me.

Sean and I have discussed these guys all the time.

It's Martin Gore and Dave Guy from Depeche Mode.

Are you fucking kidding me?

Wow.

This is fucking crazy.

A real bookie.

This is a legit fucking rave.

We were, this is like, I got ready, can I go?

Dave, Dave, hang on.

Dave, Dave and Martin, you should know.

Nice to meet you, both of you gentlemen by the way.

This is amazing.

Such an honor.

Thank you.

Pleasure.

Thank you.

And I knew that, and we've been sort of trying to work this out

to get you guys on here.

And Sean and I talk about you guys all the time.

And we talk about your music.

We talk about your songs.

And about, Sean, do you remember about a month ago

when we were talking about you guys,

and we were going to,

and I knew that it was going to happen.

And it took, it was one of the worst,

it was the hardest I've ever had to work

to keep a secret from my wife.

Oh, you knew.

It was before that.

I knew Sean when we had that conversation.

Oh my God.

You guys, I'm freaking out.

I have 17,000 things to say to you.

But we got time, Sean.

We got nothing but time, actually.

You said we have nothing but time.

Of course, Amy.

It's just a question of time.

Right?

I know every word to every song.

Every word to every song.

This is so wild.

And I have to do this for you guys because,

okay, so I'm going to start out with this.

Martin.

I've never seen,

I'm freaking out.

So Martin, you came to a taping of Will and Grace.

That is true.

I did.

Yes.

What if he didn't remember that?

I've been trying to keep that quiet for years.

This is massive fun.

That's news to Dave.

I love it.

So wait.

So you came to a taping of Will and Grace

and somebody whispered in my mirror,

you're Martin Gors in the audience.

I'm like, what are you talking about,

Martin Gors in the audience?

He's, the passion is like my life.

What are you talking about?

And then you were there with your wife

and your wife's friends or something like that.

And then you asked, let's go out to grab some fish and chips

at the standard hotel on Sunset Boulevard.

And I was like, oh my God,

I'm going to go out for fish and chips.

I've never had fish and chips.

This is so exciting.

So we go out for fish and I'm walking down the street with you,

which was so surreal to me.

And I did, I did this bit for you,

which is waiting for the night off a violator.

And I'll do it for you now, which is,

wait, wait for it.

It will cut out the long bar.

Cause this is what I used to do in college.

Here it comes.

This is it.

This is coming up.

And I wrote my fucking senior thesis paper on this song.

Come on.

In college.

Wow.

Swear to God.

Here we go.

Here we go.

This is it.

You're taking off the glasses.

This is it.

Uh-oh.

Cause it's not like a bug.

I've never thought of that as sounding like a bug.

But now that you have given me that visual,

when we perform that song every night,

I will be thinking of you.

Time to reshoot the video.

So Dave and Martin,

how do you guys respond to,

Sean Hayes has just boiled your music down

to sounding like a bug.

Oh my God.

This is unbelievable.

Again, like, you know, not to belabor it,

but we talk about you guys all the time,

such massive fans of your music,

and have been, and all the way through.

And we've had the good fortune of having bands on the show

who have been played important parts of our lives,

but there are a few bands like you guys

who have been there consistently over time.

And that is also the mark of real greatness,

is showing consistency over time.

And you're still doing it.

And so I kind of want to go back to the very beginning,

if I may, and not to bore you,

because we're so interested to hear about

how Depeche Mode came to be.

And each one of you,

I know that you each have a different journey

is how you became part of Depeche Mode.

And I'd love to sort of hear from you guys

what that process was.

Shaking right now.

Well, Vince and Andy really started the whole thing.

They had like a little band going.

And I bought a synthesizer,

so that kind of like got me in the band.

By the way, that's a very common,

we've interviewed a bunch of bands,

and they're always like, I had a guitar,

I had a camera, whatever, right?

Well, there's a lot to do with that,

because what we found out was,

well, elaborate on this,

but you didn't need the amp anymore

and you didn't need to,

you could just DI straight into a PA system,

carried a little synth under your arm pretty much to a gig

and show up with our little drum machine

and three simps and kind of teetering on some beats

or teetering on some beer crates in a pub

or whatever as our stands,

and we could play, you know.

And Dave, did you know these guys when they first started

or did you meet them a little bit later?

Well, they were sort of infamous in the town that we grew up in

for other things,

but I did not really run in the same circles,

but it was a good thing for me

because they sort of, you know,

they gave me suddenly a focus

that I had something to kind of grab hold of

and maybe it was a way out of the town that we grew up in.

And they, yeah, I think how we met properly

was I was sort of hanging out with another band, right, Mark?

Yeah, yeah.

And we were just rehearsing in the same space

and one evening, and I knew Vince a bit,

but we were singing, sort of jamming together

the song Heroes or Bowie song.

I love it.

And Vince heard me sing in the song,

supposedly the story goes,

and asked me to join his band,

which was then a different band,

which Martin was in with Vince.

What was the name of that band?

Composition of Sound.

What an amazing name.

For sure.

Cause, cause for sure.

Cause.

Like OMD, you know, they were trying to be like OMD.

But meanwhile, it sounds like a manual

that you find in a music story.

I was like, that's got to go.

And I got such a, I got a better name,

Depeche Mode, which everybody also went like,

what?

Wait, but let's talk about that

because in French it's fast fashion,

so why, why, why fast fashion?

I'll tell you the story.

Look, I was, I was at art,

sort of art college in,

as we all were at one point.

And I was doing a fashion course there.

And there was this, this mag, there was magazines there.

I think, I think it was something like we had a gig somewhere.

We had to kind of, we were thinking about changing the name.

We had a little pub gig coming up,

and this was the moment to change the name.

So what should it be?

This magazine was a French sort of magazine,

a French fashion magazine lying there at the moment.

I had no idea what it meant or anything.

I just read it out over the phone to somebody.

I said, oh, we're Depeche Mode.

And that's a weird name.

I was like, yes, it is.

Did it put more pressure on you guys

to come up with fancy outfits?

No, we were already trying that.

Most of them homemade at that point.

So, you know, it would be,

it would be a pair of football socks with like, you know,

like up to the knees, you know,

pulled up to the knees with some cutoffs,

like to the knees and tuck them in.

And some house slippers.

To make them look, you know,

some house slippers that would come out.

Sean is fully around.

So tell me, so then, so you guys form,

so Dave, so you join and then you name it,

and you guys call yourself Depeche Mode.

You start doing gigs.

How many, before you, your first record is Speak and Spell, yeah?

Yeah.

Everywhere to every song.

Yeah, I mean, Speak and Spell.

Yeah, and I want to get into that in a second

and into Vince, Clark and,

but what was, before you released Speak and Spell,

how does that come about that you guys get that record deal?

Like, what are you doing? Where are you performing?

Yeah.

We were playing most of the songs from that record,

right in my light, with mostly Vince Clark songs.

And it was, it's really the one album that,

because Vince left immediately after that album was released.

And Dave, he's saying on that.

Before it was released.

Oh, really? Before it was released.

But he's saying on that record too, yeah?

Well, we sang together.

It was a sort of three-part harmony thing,

sort of Beach Boy meets Ramones type thing

we were going for, I guess.

But the speed of the Ramones

and the harmony of the Beach Boys,

that was, I think, had Daniel Miller

from Mute Records who signed us.

He didn't really sign us though.

It was just a sort of handshake.

We never actually signed the contract.

Is that where the song, the handshake,

is the contract?

Martin was probably just,

Martin wrote that song and he was probably just angry

at everybody at that point.

Music business and being ripped off again and again and again.

So this guy from Mute Records,

he sees you, what, in a pub or you're playing clubs?

Yes, in a pub.

We supported one of his other acts called Fad Gadget

at a pub called The Bridge House.

Fad Gadget.

You've got to check out Fad Gadget.

You guys are going to like Fad Gadget, great music.

Really?

Yes.

I'm actually going to write it down now that you say that.

Fad, F-A-D-G-A-D-E-T.

D-A-G-A-D-G-E-T.

Yeah, you've got to.

Martin went to school, I did not.

Oh, well then you're going to, I mean, Jason, anything?

Nothing.

OK.

So Daniel saw us supporting Fad Gadget with our synths set up on,

by that time we'd gone to all synths.

We started off with a bass and a guitar in the band,

but we'd gone to all synths and we had them set up on our beer crates.

And Daniel was impressed.

Yeah, we were.

We played really fast and he,

his story goes he was mixing a sound for Fad Gadget,

just a little pub in the east end of London,

called The Bridge House in Canningtown.

And, you know, we had a residency there on like Thursday nights.

The guy, even though nobody would be there,

would be like two people and a dog, you know, most of the time.

As Depeche Mode.

Yeah, as Depeche Mode.

And the guy that ran the pub,

he took a shine to us and sort of let us play there Thursday nights.

So we got this support, which was a big thing because we loved Fad Gadget.

And, you know, and Jason loved it.

Yeah, you've got to check out Fad Gadget.

So you guys, so you go and you support these guys

and then this dude from Ute Records like,

yeah, you guys are supporting Fad Gadget are pretty good.

We actually had met him before.

Vince and I had trailed around all the record companies.

We had gone to Rough Trade Records in London thinking

that we had made this masterful demo

that they were going to sign us immediately because we actually had melody

and most of their other bands at that time did not.

They were just noise.

And we thought they could assign us immediately.

And the guy that ran the record company, Scott,

he was not really interested, but he listened to our tape.

And while he was listening to the tape,

Daniel Miller happened to walk into the office

because Fad Gadget was being distributed by Rough Trade at the time.

And he was shouting about something.

He'd gone in a record store and there was no records in there or something.

And so Scott shouted out, you know, Daniel, you should listen to this.

Maybe you'll be, this is something you might be interested in.

He kind of growled a bit, looked over at me and Vince sitting there

and just, you know, and walked out.

And we were like, well, fuck him.

That's Daniel Miller from Ute Records.

We walked out there and this was, I guess,

the chance, the next chance meeting when we were opening for Fad Gadget.

Daniel was mixing the sound and he came back

afterwards and started talking to me, actually,

because he thought I'd written the songs because I was singing them.

And I said, and he asked me some questions and then you write the songs.

I was like, no, that bloke over there does.

And that was Vince.

And so he left me, of course, and went off and talked to Vince.

And after that night, he said, can I come back?

And I think we said we were playing next Thursday.

He did.

And he came back and he asked if we wanted to make a 45.

Wow.

A single, which is, yeah.

That's like 1981.

Mark, is that correct, Mark?

Is that kind of correct?

Yeah, that is correct, yeah.

Does that check out?

It was a 45.

It was a 45 then.

We called them a single.

It was a 47-inch single, a 45.

And he said, I've got enough money to do that.

I will, we don't have to sign any contracts or anything.

But so that's like 1980, 81 probably.

That was 1980.

And Daniel was still involved with us today.

No kidding.

Oh, wow.

First of all, that's incredible.

And that's a, that you have that kind of long-lasting relationship.

So it's 1980.

And what were you, you guys write this record.

What were you listening to at the time that you wrote that in 1980?

Yeah, I was going to say the same thing.

What were you listening to?

And also were you, did you think back then you were following a trend like where this,

the music business is going into synth pop and maybe we should do that,

or was that truly a genuine love?

It hadn't really started yet, had it?

We were fans of mute records.

Yeah.

So, you know, the fact that Daniel was offering us a one-off single deal,

that was amazing to us.

Yeah.

But who were the bands that were,

at that time that you were playing on your tape cassettes?

Well, like Fad Gadget.

Like, I mean, Daniel also for a while had DAF,

Deutsche Amerikanische Freundschaft.

Check them out as well.

Yeah.

DAF.

DAF.

They sing in German.

The normal.

Yeah.

The normal was Daniel himself.

Warm leatherette.

You must know that track.

You must know that song.

Grace Jones made it famous, I guess.

I don't know.

She covered it.

I was just listening to this afternoon, this morning,

I was just listening to Trio.

Do you remember the da-da-da?

Da-da-da, yeah.

Yeah, that they made up the little Casio.

I was just listening to that.

I was listening to some Blomage and I was listening to...

Blomage, yeah.

Blomage played with us a lot.

In fact, there was an album at the time called

Some Bazaar Album.

It was by this guy who put it together.

His name was Stevo.

And he put together...

Actually, our first recording that came out was on that record.

It was a song called Photographic,

which was on Speak and Spell too.

But we did...

We were part of that album.

And on that album, there was anyone from

an early track from Soft Cell?

Oh, yeah.

From Blomage?

Yeah.

From us?

Who was it, Mark?

Da-da.

Da-da.

Oh, man.

So it was a complements called Some Bazaar Album.

And so a lot of those acts after that got signed.

Well, that was...

You guys kind of were right at the forefront of that to me,

musically.

Da-da, you know, listening to...

Great band.

Especially that first great band.

That first...

You know, this is the day is still just such an anthem.

It reminds me of getting my first cool haircut when I was 12.

Yeah.

And then...

But listening to that, you know, listening to you guys,

listening to...

And then Vince, of course, went on to form in the U.K.

known as Yazoo and America known as Yaz with Allison Moyet.

And then he went off with Andy Bell and formed Rizzer as well.

But you guys were right there at the forefront of all of that.

And I always wondered, like...

Well, these are bands that not a lot of people know,

but you guys weren't listening to...

It was post-punk.

You gotta remember, like, in England, it was coming out of the ashes of...

It was over.

Punk was over in England.

We listened to Clash, though.

Like, was that your thing?

Yeah.

Well, there was the Pistols, the Clash, the Damned,

Susie and the band.

All these bands were kind of either evolving towards the end of,

like, 77, 78, into whatever that was coming,

or they were kind of...

It was over, you know.

Yeah.

And we kind of...

That do-it-yourself attitude, I think,

is what we brought into...

Well, you guys were...

You guys had your own unique sound coming out of that,

in the same way, sort of, in the punk world,

that, like, Paul Weller and the jam never really fit quite into the punk.

Right.

And Paul...

And then he ended up, of course,

and you guys probably know him,

and he's amazing, and went off and did style counsel.

But in that same way that you guys kind of took from...

Or were born out of a different era,

and then created your own genre in a way.

I mean, not to put you on the spot,

but...

Because there weren't a lot of people who were making

what you guys were doing.

People just started doing...

And I don't...

Like, Bronsky beat, you know, they were doing stuff,

but they came after you guys,

like, two years after speaking stuff.

Yeah, it's almost like we had Bono on,

and we were talking about how, you know,

when all these pop stars, like Madonna, Michael Jackson,

all these other kind of, like, big pop stars...

And here comes Joshua Tree, this album that was so, like...

Wait, what?

It's so alternative.

And then you guys came along, I think,

in the same kind of way, where it's just like,

it was left of center from what everybody else is listening to.

Back then, in, like, 98.

We didn't really fit in any of that stuff.

Yeah, that's what I mean.

Yeah, that's what I mean.

It was like, we always...

We always kind of were the odd one, banned out,

in that there was a wave of stuff that came,

but we never quite fit.

And I think that was a really good thing,

and I think a lot of that was to do with Daniel Miller,

and his guidance in kind of allowing us to slowly,

like, develop into what it was we wanted to be.

And by the time we got to Black Celebration,

I think we had kind of found, a bit before that,

but we had found our own way, right, Mark?

We sort of found...

Yeah, it took us a while, yeah.

Yeah.

And we will be right back.

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And now back to the show.

Martin, so Vince Lee,

like I alluded to,

Vince leaves and goes and with Alison Moyet

and goes and does, first does Yazoo.

And Martin, did you, so then you started writing more,

because Vince had written,

or were you guys equally writing,

or how did that happen that you sort of

stepped into that position?

I don't even mean to put it, I don't know how to.

No, yeah, I wrote a couple of songs on the first album.

And yeah, because I was the only one who actually wrote songs

when Vince left, I kind of had to do it.

Right.

It was just like we were like,

and Daniel literally was like,

does anybody else write songs?

Because you're right or is left.

And we were like, does that mean it's over?

And it's sort of, mine was like,

I'll go a couple of songs.

Well, I was lucky.

Well, the album was a very weird collection of songs,

because some of them I wrote when I was 16,

and then some of them I was making up in the studio

when we were trying to finish the album.

Which album? Black Salvation, you mean?

A Broken Frame.

Okay, so what was the,

after he left and you stepped into that role,

as Dave says, because everybody else is looking around

going, who the fuck is going to do this?

What was the first, when you started writing,

what was the first sort of like big hit that you wrote?

And everybody's like, ah, fuck yeah, Martin, well done, man.

It was straight away actually.

The first thing we recorded was See You,

and then you released that as a single,

and that was a massive hit, so.

Wow.

We actually went the highest, we'd gone in the charts,

and then we went to number six,

was a big thing, and Martin had this new synthesizer

called the PPG.

So we didn't use much equipment in the studio.

There was like a few pieces,

Dan, you had a couple of pieces of electronic stuff,

and so you kind of were very,

and there was no sampling then,

there was no, you know,

it wasn't like, how now you just kind of like,

it's almost too much.

Like, but we picked,

we had these few pieces,

so this one synthesizer

dominated the sort of sound,

I would say, right, Martin,

of that song in particular.

And it was a good song,

it was a great pop song,

it was like a sort of Everly Brothers song or something,

and we, you know,

went on TV,

and it was a big hit.

I think it was more Herman's Hermits.

Mrs. Brown, you've got a lovely song.

I was going to say to me,

I thought that was too fast.

Give us a break.

My grandparents used to have a Herman's Hermits record

for some reason,

and we used to play it when we were kids.

Do you remember that Mrs. Brown, you've got a lovely daughter?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You've got to remember, I was only 10

when this was happening.

Are you guys so shocked that your song

Just Can't Get Enough is used everywhere,

always, all the time?

It's mad, it's like,

it's in the cocaine bear,

it's like, you know what,

it fits everywhere.

I mean, of all your songs,

I really do know,

probably every word to every song,

and I'm like, that's the song everybody plays everywhere.

I know.

Wait, what?

You know, it's funny, when Vince wrote that song,

I think we were,

the first publisher that he had,

we were at the offices, and I think,

what I'm saying,

he said something like this to the rest of us,

we were sitting on the couch,

we kind of squashed together,

and he looked at Vince and he said,

he is going to be driving a Rolls Royce,

while you three are on the tandem,

and we were like,

you know, bicycle,

and we were like,

why?

And we all signed this deal,

I think he gave us 100 quid each,

for like, to sign,

he did.

We were like, he's giving us 100 quid for nothing,

you know,

signed this deal.

We can buy a tandem for that.

We were like, yeah, we will buy that tandem.

But Vince, you know,

he told Vince, you know,

you'll be driving in a Rolls Royce,

and he said, this song is going to

continue, like forever,

and we were just kind of like,

don't think so.

But we were very impressed,

because he took us out for lunch,

and Errol Brown from Hot Chocolate

was in the same restaurant.

Yes, that's right, I remember that.

Do you remember the band Hot Chocolate?

No!

I believe in Lucas!

Oh, yes!

Hot Chocolate, they were called.

We were like, holy shit,

there's Errol Brown from Hot Chocolate.

So, you have some hits in the UK,

obviously.

What was your first recognition in the US

that you knew that people were listening

to the band in the US?

Well, I think that Just Can't Get Enough

did get some underground play,

like obviously club play and stuff like that.

But I think the first radio thing

was probably People Are People.

Yeah, it was huge.

And it was still, like, really underground.

It was...

We were never really

played on mainstream radio,

right.

And then talk about, like,

first of all, I used to get,

I look like exactly like Dave Gahn

all the time in college.

People were like, you look just like Dave Gahn.

I could see that.

Wow!

You better look in though.

The Rose Bowl,

wasn't that just life career changing

when you sold out the Rose Bowl to everybody?

That was later.

It was a very happy accident, to be honest.

It was...

But it blew everybody's mind.

I remember the press was like, wait, what?

It blew our minds.

I mean, we were not prepared, really.

It was one of those things that

I think it was suggested to us

that we could do this

at the end of that particular tour,

Music for the Masses tour.

A big show somewhere where all the fans

would travel like in a grateful dead way.

We kind of had that kind of following.

And they did.

We ended up doing it.

And D.A. Penny Baker filmed the whole thing for us.

Which was also kind of iconic

to be now looking back.

I see pictures from then.

I see Penny is not with us anymore.

But we used to think

he was extremely old.

When we were on that tour

and he was documenting the whole thing with us.

He was like this old guy.

We used to help him around the stage.

Be careful with that 35mm.

You're going to fall over, dude.

And he was like

maybe 50?

I don't know.

And we were like so old.

Like this guy. Who's this guy?

And he was just amazed with

what he was amazed with. Not really the music

or anything. It was the

scale.

It was the fans.

It was kind of a cult.

It was the fandom. It was like the cult

of the following that we had.

Why are they obsessed

with this band?

And still to this day

we carry that

sign.

It's like

The Church of Depeche Mode or something.

Does that feel

heavy sometimes?

Or is it something that changes

your relationship to it? Does it kind of

shift?

No. One thing

I've realised recently though

is I'm a big soccer fan.

And soccer fans always

think

they know better than the manager of the team they support.

Oh, yeah.

So our fans,

you've gone on any of the forums,

all of our fans, they're always complaining.

They're never happy with what we do.

They're basically arsenal

supporters.

Wait, Martin, are you an arsenal

supporter? I am.

Did you grew up in north London then?

No, east London.

I thought you were going to be West Ham.

Yeah, I should have been a West Ham supporter, but

no.

You make a decision when you're like

9 or 10, don't you?

And you stick with it, you can't change.

Where we came from, it was like Arsenal,

West Ham or Chelsea basically.

That was kind of like

Dave, are you a football supporter?

I was a Chelsea fan.

And I stopped going into Chelsea

after getting a total beating

actually at Arsenal.

I got chased down the street

by a bunch of Arsenal fans.

Ended up rolling underneath a car

to escape death.

I just got such a beating.

I think I was about 15.

That was the last time I went into it.

I led them away, by the way.

You finally led them away.

Martin's done that a few times for me, by the way.

You showed them where you was at first,

and then you're like, this is too much.

I just read this book by this writer, Bill Buford,

called Among the Thugs, which is about

the Chelsea crew were called

the Crazy Gang, and it was

basically people went to soccer to fight.

That was kind of what it was.

There was this huge, and it got

scary. It got really

to the point where it was very dangerous.

There's a movie that Gary Oldham's in, actually.

The Firm. I've seen it.

That's very much what it was.

About the West Ham supporters.

It was Chelsea supporters and

West Ham supporters, I think. Millwall, too.

Oh, Millwall. That's tough.

That's tough.

Hey, guys, where did the...

I just remember always being

so taken by the mood you guys set

with your music, and also

just your stage craft.

The whole aesthetic of the band,

it was, it is so

sort of, I don't know what the right term would be,

dramatic, cinematic, dark.

Yeah, but I mean, I don't remember

that anybody

blazing a trail before you guys in that world.

There's many, many sort of

people that try to replicate that

since then, for sure.

But where did that come from?

Was that deliberate?

Or was it just kind of where you guys were at?

Were you inspired by something?

I think we were lucky

when we wrote

Black Celebration, that we got involved

with Anton Corbin,

who became

the visual head for the band.

Who's that? I'm an idiot. Who is that?

He's an incredible director. There are a lot of videos, yeah?

But he's a film director.

He's a very tall Dutchman.

He started out as a photographer.

Okay.

For the NME,

with New Musical Express in London,

he got to be the front cover guy

that would do

the covers of that paper.

It would always be like this amazing photograph

of Joy Division, or Echo and the Bunny Men,

or Susie Sool from the band.

She's in there, always with Anton's shots.

Wow.

At that time,

working with Anton

were pretty slim, but

the first time we worked with him,

I think it was 81,

actually, and then we didn't work with him again

until 85, Mark.

86 with Black Celebration, yeah.

81, we got the cover

of the NME,

and Anton was shooting it.

He had to shoot us.

He had to shoot us.

I don't think he really wanted to,

but we were cool,

and we weren't.

I mean, we were trying to be cool, but...

And did he style that shoot

in such a way that you guys

sort of borrowed from

and adopted going forward?

I think it sort of began there,

even though we weren't probably aware of it,

but by the time we got

to Black Celebration,

we had been working in Berlin,

Hansa Studios,

the very famous iconic Hansa,

David and

Iggy and

various other people that we

looked up to

and were influenced by.

And

I think that's where it really started for us.

Martin had moved to Berlin as well

for a short period of time there as well,

and we started working there a lot.

West Berlin.

When the wall was very much still up,

and we used to work right...

There was a studio called Hansa,

which was on the wall.

So when you were on the balcony of the studio,

you literally were looking over the wall

and you'd see these soldiers,

hence the Bowies

lying in heroes,

but about the wall,

I think.

Heroes always reminds me of Christiane F.

Remember that film's in West Berlin?

It was on the soundtrack.

That's a great film.

Do you guys also...

I'm sorry for the dumb, dumb question,

but I don't know.

Is there why the religious undertones?

So many of them.

I don't know.

Spirituality, bro.

They both just turned poetic.

I've never been religious.

I'm always searching.

Aren't we always searching?

Yeah, sure.

And then it's this...

I feel often, especially when I'm singing

Martin's words,

there's this kind of...

Sometimes it's like a...

It can be like an experience

that when you're singing and sometimes

you're kind of in a big place,

like we just did The Garden

or whatever.

There's certain gigs that you do.

It's this sort of experience.

It is like a sort of, I don't know,

spiritual experience.

There's something that's there.

And it's also that I have a kind of disdain for it, too.

It feels like...

you know...

a lot of bollocks as well.

It's at the same time.

I mean, you even sort of take it...

I mean, I've always loved

Blasphemous Rumors because I just love that

lyric. I don't want to start any Blasphemous Rumors.

Blasphemous Rumors, but I think that God's got

a sixth sense of humor.

And when I die, I expect to find him laughing.

Laughing, yeah.

I've always been obsessed.

People miss the comedy, see?

They miss the comedy in what we do.

They just sort of miss the humor

from Martin.

And they miss the delivery from Dave.

But, you know,

it's all there.

You just got a little...

The only reason I brought it up, because I love the comment

and the cleverness of the

language that you choose.

It's really cool.

But then it also did fit into Jason kind of what you were asking about

into the...

Yeah, it became...

And you get that...

I think we like that.

You have to bring that imagery.

A bit of theater and...

Well, what was it about the writing though, Dave,

that always sort of kind of presented a block

for you? Because obviously,

you're a very intelligent man.

Know how to speak, know how to write, I'm sure,

and tell stories and whatnot.

But when it comes to lyrics,

is it...

And Martin, I'm sure you can speak better to this too.

Is there an attempt to tell a story

when you write a lyric or just to

set some poetry that then obviously

comes later to fit that or vice versa?

What was the thing that

kept you away from it early on, Dave?

Well, in the early days

and also, you know,

even now when we're singing a lot of these

great songs that Martin's written,

they always change too.

They change over the years,

depending on what's going on in your life.

They represent something different

and they take...

their memories.

Songs and memories, you know.

They're there and they're there also

to develop

new memories

of yet to come.

You know.

But I feel like

if you really tap into a good song

when you're writing and there's something

and it doesn't, you know, you kind of have to

work at it sometimes, but sometimes

if you really let go of control

of the lyric or whatever and allow

something to just,

you know, it's a combination of things

that might happen at the same time,

you could just follow the idea.

You know, it's just allow it to just, you know.

And other things you have to

kind of like, you know,

move...when we're working in a studio

together, for instance, if Martin's,

you know, is always right in the majority

of the songs,

I try and create...

I've worked with a song

for a long time before I

actually go to finally sing it.

So I want to live with that song for a long

time and when I step up

to the mic, I already know where I want to go

with it and it's always somewhere visual.

It's a visual voice.

But the melody that perhaps you've written

to go with it or chosen to go with it,

I would imagine would

inform what words

work or what words don't work anymore.

It can. They serve each other

and it's a lot of the time it's

about removing stuff. We did that a lot

on this record. We sort of...

We...there's a lot of clutter

that you automatically put in place

because you think it's supposed to be there,

but quite often it's removing things

to allow a simple

idea to really

come through. Alright, and I love like,

you know, almost all your melodies

that you guys write are...you think

it's going to go to the

obvious one that the ear is familiar with

and BOOM! You take a left turn.

That's mine. He'll take one

of my songs, for instance, that we were

working to say a song like Wagon Tunk,

which is on this record, and I sent

my little demo to Martin of me,

like, ham-fistedly playing on a guitar

trying to get the song out and find the chords

and that, and I send it to Martin

and then Martin sends it back with this beautiful

like, Kraftwerk-esque like

chords and arpeggiating

synths and stuff, and I'm like,

oh, okay.

I love that. But then that takes me

then to another place, you see.

That changes the perception yet again.

I'm sure it's the same with you guys when

you're working in film and

behind or in front of the camera.

Yes, and...

You feed off an audience in theater,

I'm sure, and then when it's...

you're just in a room together and you've got

a bunch of crew standing around you

and you've got to create it for yourself.

Otherwise, there's just this bunch of crew

around you.

Well, it is true that I can speak

because the three of us, I've worked with

both these guys and neither

none of us really sort of

come in prepared in the sense that we don't

fully have it

memorized a certain way. You can't.

You have to kind of have a loose

relationship with

whatever you're doing because

so much of it is informed

by what the other person is

bringing. You sort of leave room for the effect

of the other. Yeah, like

that's a...

Well, can I just really quick, and then

we'll get off this. Jay, I'm going to send

you this song because it's one of the most famous songs.

It's such an old song. It's called Somebody.

But you'll love it because, and I love this

because the dum-dums didn't quite get it

back then about the comment.

I want somebody to share, share the rest

of my life, share my innermost thoughts,

know my intimate details. It goes on

and on in this gorgeous lyrics about

sharing your life with somebody.

And the last lyrics at the end is

though things like this

make me sick in a case like this, I'll

get away with it. Which completely

obliterates the whole song.

Like as a kid, I was like, wait a minute,

I was about to cry this.

Because love is bollocks, that's why.

Love is bollocks.

It still gets played at lots

and lots of weddings.

I'm sure.

So Martin's just having a laugh at everybody

else's expense.

So for a dummy

music listener like me, I always

struggle to hear what

the words...

What did they say? What did they know? Back it up, is it?

I'll screw it, I'll just listen to you.

Martin, have you ever had a

point where you've gone to Dave and you said

this is a beautiful line

and I can't understand what you're saying.

Annunciate more.

Don't just mumble that because it sounds

right?

You're sort of missing this word

structure that you're doing.

It depends how drunk you are.

There's that tipping point.

We all know the tipping point.

It's great and then

it's not Greg anymore.

Back in the day.

We were lucky that we sorted something out

before you actually had to do

a guide vocal in the studio because

there's a track that didn't go on the album

that's coming later in the year

and it's called Life 2.0.

What did you think it was called, Dave?

Oh, yeah.

Do you do?

No. Life...

What was it, Mark? I forgot.

Life 2...

To...

To perform or something?

I don't know. Life 2.0.

I think I even wrote it down.

When Mark sent me the song

he often doesn't send the words.

He'll send a demo or whatever

and so I kind of listened.

Life 2.0.

That was it.

Life 2.0.

I was like, okay, alright.

Life 2.0.

I don't think anyone's ever used the word

life 2.0.

Dave, when you're performing it later

in the year you've got to

or if you're performing it now on stage

you've got to get the audience going

saying life 2.0.

That can happen. I said the other night

let's go Nick's

because at the end of everything counts

I just shout out in the garden

let's go Nick's.

A lot of people sigh.

Oh, that must have gone big.

We'll be right back.

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Back to the show.

Did I hear you say

that it got kind of Kraftwerk-esque?

Did you say it? Yes, yes.

It's so funny because you're like the third

band that's referenced Kraftwerk and I was

just listening to Tour de France this morning

as well, which is such a, I love that tune.

And I think

it was Jay when you had the boys

from Radiohead were talking about Kraftwerk

as well. Like it was just

what an influential band these guys were.

It's unbelievable. Well, they were probably

instrumental in getting a synth, I was

really imagined in the first place. Really?

Yeah, and we were talking

about the early bands that influenced us.

We mentioned that wave that was

coming up with us, but they were obviously way

before that. You know, Autobahn was

like 74. Yeah.

Wow, man.

That's wild. I think Daniel as well.

Daniel Miller, like he's sort of

once he cut his influence,

he was listening to, you know, he's a little

bit older than us. So there was like

Neue and there was all these like German

kind of, those that kind of

stuff, Mark, that like

we wouldn't have probably heard really

if it wasn't for him. And it's that

sort of kraut rock that was called

like that stuff as well.

A lot of like the, like waiting

for the ninth to fall for instance, it's got that

continuous kind of like

rolling progression all the time.

These influences definitely

we were lucky

to work with a lot of people,

engineers, producer, people that were

all on that cusp as well

of wanting to do something

new with pop music.

Well, you guys had that, you guys also embodied

that too, Martin, you know, that sort

of, like you said, Dave, that

progression, you guys understood the importance

of it that sort of drove

so many of your songs.

Atmosphere. Atmosphere and almost

hypnotic, right? Atmosphere

over a lot of other things

sometimes. We would go around with

like tape machines into

like scrapyards or building

sites and record like weird

shit noises

that you heard. Everything Counts has all

that stuff at the start, right? Yeah, I don't even

know what that was now. What was that?

That was like a saw

or something.

Industrial. That

was like a Chinese violin that was

badly something. Oh, yes.

That we couldn't play. It was an instrument that we

couldn't play that you just

might have played. Jason, do you want to hear me

say that again? Yeah, no, I think we got it.

You guys are

uniquely

qualified to comment about where

we find the music industry today

and are you guys a big fan

or is it a love hate with

what technology and digital

and all that stuff has done as far as the

way in which music is sold nowadays

and what that's done to the touring business

and whatnot because you guys obviously have the best of both

worlds. I mean, you're still playing Madison Square Garden

and you're still selling albums

but so how does all that

sit with you today's current

makeup of the business?

Sorry and be honest.

We came up. It's kind of good and bad, right?

We came up.

It was like albums, vinyl

get in

that record

going to having enough money

to go buy a 45 or 70

which was I think at the time

when I'm in first probably 45p

or whatever that was

something like that.

To go, you stole it from somewhere

and you went to the market

and you looked through the singles and looked at the covers

and go, this one looks weird and interesting

and what is this?

Of course, we had one

show in England, this TV show

called Top of the Pops where you

on Thursday nights or whatever

you'd see music like Bowie

and Gary Glitter

and Slade and T-Rex

and all these sort

of 70s things

of Roxy Music.

That was our thing.

That was where you get lost in it

but I think the album,

I know Martin does as well

we both still play albums

and buy albums and stuff

and listen to music

digitally too.

There's something has been lost

of course in that

the specialness of an album

and how you listen

to that, how you play

one side and then turn it over

and you've got to actually make the effort

to do something.

Right.

I love that.

I remember sitting in a room

and taking it out of the sleeve

and putting it on.

The smell of it.

You'd have a cleaner

you'd have the duster

the brush and you'd let it go around

and clean off the needle

and drop the needle on it and sit there

and maybe you would have lyrics.

Sometimes if a record came out you were waiting for

and it had lyrics, you were like

and this one's got lyrics.

That was so, I mean the Bowie stuff

I remember I stole from

my friend Phil Gurry.

I was around his house and he had

and I was

around his flat and he had

the Double Live David Live

at the Philadelphia Tower album

and I opened it up and I saw

that this lyric sheet like the sleeve

fell out and I was just

kind of like sitting there and he went off to the toilet

or something for a minute and when he was gone

I took it, I folded it up

and I shoved it in my jacket and I was like

stole, I would steal everything

if it wasn't tied down by the way

but I stole this and I got it home

and I had the lyrics myself

and I was thinking about a week later

Phil was like I know you stole my lyrics

I denied it

but you know

that's how special it was

to have something like that because you couldn't look it up

I had a roommate in college who was obsessed

with albums and I took his

Beethoven, what was that group?

Beethoven?

Yeah, take the skinheads bowling.

Yeah and I took that

I was really

sitting in his room, we were listening to albums

and I took the jacket and I was so hot

and I took the album jacket

and I started fanning myself

and completely bent the whole thing

and he never heard from him again

he wouldn't talk to me again

I remember how

I have so many like different record memories

the one that I remember

when that First Simple Minds record came out

and they did a clear record

do you remember that?

We have a red vinyl right now

Memento Mori

Do you really?

It came out in red vinyl

There's a clear one as well

and there's a red one

180 gram

it's cool, it's really cool

Well now I'm going to buy it because I'm going to come full circle

so you have this

this record came out

by the way, I was just thinking about the video

that I just saw

also has like sort of like

I guess religious

you guys are in a graveyard

Yes, well it's a big camp too

come on let's face it

I'm crawling around on my hands and knees

in the grave of Martin sitting playing

oh so thoughtfully

his guitar

I'm crawling around him like

sniff the glove

Yes, so we have to

when Anton Corbin says to me

so Dave I want you to get on

hands and knees

this graveyard is just

set up in a studio by the way

as well of course

and it looks already very

as soon as we get there we're like

this looks

like somebody set this up

I wanted to look kind of fake

Dave and I was like ok

he's the only person

that would get me to do something like that

and I think we did about 20 takes

of me crawling around

I'm surprised he didn't do that actually

Snout the leash

Yes, the only way

we got away is because I'm the one

crawling around of course

you know, beautiful girl

or guy to do that or something

we would be in big trouble now Dave

I have a question

how do you guys determine who sings

what track

it's kind of obvious sometimes

it's usually obvious

it's usually obvious

just because of where

the range is

well, the soul with me

on this album I knew

I thought to myself Martin would just be

able to sing that so much better than me

we have a different

tone, a different way we sing

but together

it's just unbelievable

I used to get bent out of shape a bit

I used to years ago I wanted to sing

everything and I used to feel like

my voice wasn't good enough

and that's why Martin would sing a couple of songs

it was back in

years ago

but now I don't

what it means you got a break on stage as well

I get a break too

it's a two hour set

plus I need that 10 minutes

or so in the middle to get some

oxygen but isn't that funny

now see this to all of us

all gentlemen over 50

isn't that funny you get to this age

all the things that you take personally

or bother you or whatever

it's so stupid

I'd rather take the break

I take the break

I will take the break for sure

what are you doing on your breaks

nowadays like at the garden

during your 10 minutes versus what you were doing

30-40 years ago during your 10 minute break

has that changed back stage

that's changed a lot

for Jason and me it's changed a lot

we don't partake

it's changed a lot

we probably squeezed in a nap

we would have been

looking for something

to just get a little bit more electricity

into that set

was that fun playing the garden

it must have been fantastic

it always is

it's the church of New York

they must have gone there

we've been lucky enough to play there a lot of times

over the years

it's always one of those gigs that you're

you know it's the anticipation

and everything about it

I was lucky enough this time as well

my daughter's band Stella Rose and the Dead Language

they we got

had them open for us

so it was

the nepotism was out of the charts

yeah good

you give the shit about this nepo baby

I don't give a fucking shit about the nepo baby

shut up

you do it if you could too

wait here's the other thing man

that is a great name for a band

I know nepo baby

no Stella Rose and the Dead Language

the Dead Language is

fucking great

they're pretty cool

they're like way cooler than us

you know

but we were the headline in acts

so yeah yeah

because it's me I have to ask

have you ever been approached or would you ever do

from the ground up

with new songs

a Broadway musical

we did get asked once somebody had this idea

they showed us a script

but it was all about like a bunch of heroin addicts

five six seven eight

so you know we politely

turned it down

Jason and I would like to

and Sean's gonna

obviously gonna run it gonna direct in seven

it's about a bunch of middle aged white guy golfers

you got something there for sure

you definitely got something there

I just want to say before we let you guys go

because this has been absolutely mind blowing

incredible

Sean and this is really Sean

to you

what would you say Sean can you believe

that the college is you

you guys I can't even describe it

I have to tell you guys right now to your faces

this is the honest to God truth

I'm doing a show here in New York Broadway show

and every day

I walk to the theater sometimes I get a ride

sometimes I walk

every time I walk

I listen to you guys

I literally as I'm walking I'll go

hey Siri play depeche note

and tell in the Broadway show is about a heroin addict

that's a true story though

and I want to say this before you leave

such a massive

massive influence on me

and my life in such a huge way

just incredible

all of us

the posters up in college

and the concerts I've been to

to see you guys it's just everywhere

it's just I can't

I mean that's a cool thing about

what we get to do

is that over the years

that we get to hear from somebody

like you or other artists

other musicians and stuff

what we've done somehow has influenced

like them to do what they do

and this is

how it goes around and that's

I think an amazing thing

about music and film

and stuff like that how it can

come to be the soundtrack to our lives

for sure I mean it's inside

of my DNA now

and when you guys just popped on screen here

I was shaking

and Sean I mean can you

what I was going to say was

what would college Sean Hay

say to this moment

like what would you

say to this idiot and be so over the top

and trying to be funny and then

you guys would be like that guy's too much

and then you would move on

we would probably let you hang out

we would probably let you hang out

if he was entertaining for a bit

you would have been hanging out with us

a bit as being kind

well you've been the soundtrack

to so many millions of people's lives

and you're both such great guys

on top of it all what an absolute

just pleasure and honor

congratulations on the new record of the tour

I really want to come and see you guys

are you in LA in September right

we're coming

we just finished a little run in the states

but we're coming back I think

September October November December

we're doing

a much bigger North American tour

we're off to Europe

we're going to come and see you guys

oh please yeah thanks

for having us on your show

it's really

this has been a dream come true

yeah

in all three of you

in some way shape or form

also have been

in my life so I can say that

we apologize

we don't always have to say that

honestly as well

but I mean that

sincerely thank you

cheers guys all the best

we'll see you on the road

see you guys

thanks guys thank you

wow

well are you guys alright

I mean I was really honestly truly shaking

like I haven't done that

Sean are you sitting on plastic did you lay down some plastic

Scotty

just under frame lay down some plastic for you

that's why Scotty came in at the middle

yeah I mean

not since the Michael Jackson concert

in 1983 was I shaking

I mean they really

care to god listen to them every day

no I know that's crazy

unbelievable

why is that something that kind of

gets you going for the show

I think a lot of

they have a big gay following

and I think because it was

they were cool

and underground

and like left of center

and they weren't like machismo

hard

big hair rock and you know

there was something kind of interestingly glam

about them kind of like Bowie was

beforehand yeah Sean I

get that I think I know what you're saying

it's not a gay straight thing or anything

it's just I had a lot of gay

friends in college that we found

this band and were like oh they're so cool

I think I know what you mean and there was

there were some bands that sort of came

certainly erasure were a band

that were big and gay culture

back in the 80s right because

I guess a lot of the Peshmoons songs were turned

into dance songs and they would play them in

the clubs and so I think

that personal Jesus everybody knows personal Jesus

and you know all those

earlier songs they're they have

they have a beat that you can dance to

and so they turned those

into club mixes and I think

that's probably one of the reasons we're like

oh what's this band it's so cool plus they were like

dark would it be funny if I got a personal

assistant named Jesus

no

why would that be funny because then

I'd have a personal Jesus

oh

wow I'm slow today it's a long

walk around the block but boy the address

is nice

but

just blown away and there was

there a huge part of my life yeah

yeah same I

have so many it's kind of like when we've

had other but for these guys

I have those markers

in my in my mind of where

where I was when that came out just

can't get enough

personal Jesus

all those things people are people

people just like

you know

Jay you would know like no all those

you just mentioned I know yeah

I'm

very very aware of Depeche Mode I just I wasn't

I didn't have the glow stick

in my teeth like you did Sean and Will

you know I was just fucking like

how was I supposed to find my way home

you know

I believe before Jason really got into

classical music you'd get in his

car with him I'm not kidding

and the fucking music that Jason would

I know so it would be so random

not necessarily bad but it would be like

random and some would be

brutal yeah by the way I got into it with

a woman on Instagram about two months

ago Sean maybe I told you because she was

saying it's actually you're thinking of

Yazoo it's not Yaz and I said no in

North America Yazoo was called Yaz for

legal reasons and I had to

don't fucking correct me anyway

what was Soft Cells Big Hit

Tainted Love

I listened to that too and I love

Classic Rock but I also loved so much

I loved Bronsky Beat

I just loved it so much

I loved all those bands I loved

and of course Depeche Mode

I don't know

but you know like

when they first came on I was looking

here we go boy man I tell you

something you know what it is

it's a look in your eye and it's

you kind of take a breath

here comes my moment

so thank god

I had my glasses on

when they came on because I couldn't believe

my eyes so I thank god I saw

them with my reading part

of my lower glasses which are

sometimes called

what's those glasses called

don't go up high

bye

that's a Depeche Mode

version of goodbye

it's Martin taking it left

instead of right

that's right

bye

focals

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