My First Million: #62 - Lambda School for Secretaries, Billionaire of The Week, Deepfakes & More

All right.

Quick break to tell you about another podcast that we're interested in right now, HubSpot

just launched a Shark Tank rewatch podcast called Another Bite.

Every week, the hosts relive the latest and greatest pitches from Shark Tank, from Squatty

Potty to the Mench on a Bench to Ring Doorbell, and they break down why these pitches were

winners or losers.

And each company's go-to-market strategy, branding, pricing, valuation, everything.

Basically all the things you want to know about how to survive the tank and scale your

company on your own.

If you want to give it a listen, you can find Another Bite on whatever podcast app you listen

to, like Apple or Spotify or whatever you're using right now.

All right.

Back to the show.

Okay.

We got a friend of the show, Jordan Harbinger is here.

Jordan, how are you doing, man?

Thanks for having me on, man.

I'm just chilling, self-isolating, you know, the use.

We are all isolating, but I appreciate you dropping in on the show, just parachuting

in, just for a couple of minutes.

It's always fun to have you.

You know, this is a crazy time, 2020 has been a crazy year.

We've got coronavirus and we also had, you know, the sad, tragic passing of Kobe Bryant,

who was a guest on your show.

How did that happen?

How do you get Kobe?

Yeah.

You know what was funny is I was pitching a publicity team for a different guest that

I can't even remember now because he was about 1% as famous as Kobe Bryant and they

booked it and it was like some comedian, which I of course was really excited about.

They booked it and they canceled it and I got really annoyed and they said, well, would

you consider interviewing Kobe Bryant instead?

And I said, yeah, of course I would consider that.

Let's do that.

So we set it up and I flew down to Kobe's office and went over there and hung out for

a while and did the interview right there.

And it was, it was incredible.

It was a really interesting experience to be there with his team as well for that day.

And honestly, it was probably September of 2019.

So the timing was, was interesting and you know me, I asked him all kinds of questions

that had nothing to do with basketball, including about creativity, business, hiring and firing

because you wonder how a guy like Kobe Bryant decides who to hire and how he lets people

go.

I don't know if I'd want to be on the wrong side of him.

And I did end up asking him about his life and what he's going to do for his second act

and if he ever creepily, I asked him if he ever thinks about what he's going to do if

he were gone because he has kids and he was really, really honest in the interview.

He was really, really straightforward and I admire that it was a really good interview

in my opinion.

Yeah.

That is intense.

High stakes interviewing to say the least and was he like an idol of yours before you

did the interview?

No, man.

Honestly, I look who doesn't love watching basketball, but I wasn't even, I'm just not

a fanboy of athletes in general.

So it was a great unique opportunity, but I wasn't nervous because of that.

I was more nervous because you just never know if your audio equipment's going to screw

up.

I was more nervous like make sure it's recording than I was nervous to be sitting in front

of Kobe Bryant.

Honestly, he was so friendly and unassuming and not very loud.

In fact, we even had audio issues recording it because we're like, hey, we got to turn

him up really high.

And I said, you're really quiet.

And he goes, yeah, I'm just not a loud guy, man.

And I was like, oh my God, can you be loud for like the next 45 minutes?

So it was a really unique experience.

I'll be thankful for that for a long time to come.

That is amazing.

You know, when we started this show, we were doing the interview style thing and I made

it a bucket list, a wish list of all the guests that I would want.

You know, Kobe was on there.

And when I look at your show and I've been going, I've been plowing through the archive

of episodes that you've got, you've had a bunch of them.

So you've had Tony Hawk, you've had Kobe Bryant, who are some of the other awesome episodes

that people should check out if they do binge your show like I'm doing?

Sure.

Yeah.

Howie Mandel was really good, the comedian.

He was very open about things like mental illness and how he doesn't shake people's

hands.

I've had Dennis Rodman, Malcolm Gladwell, and I also had Frank Abagnale, which a lot

of people haven't heard about or from, but he is the catch me if you can guy.

So he's the real guy that was played by Leo DiCaprio.

And we talked about the psychology behind how he was able to trick so many people.

And now he teaches, of course, FBI and intelligence agencies how that's done as well.

That is amazing.

So if you're one of the listeners to the show who misses when we used to do the interviews

and bring in guests, well, this is, this is my recommendation for you.

You should go check out the Jordan Harbinger show.

He's got tons of interviews from guests that we were, you know, hoping to one day have on

our show.

He's already had them on.

Check them out on iTunes, on Spotify, wherever you can find it.

Jordan, appreciate you as always dropping in on the show.

Yeah.

I guess Sam, how are you doing, man?

Why are you so angry?

God fucking shit.

Nothing works.

I hate everything.

My Apple TV is not working.

Quick times out working.

I hate zoom.

God damn.

I hate your mohawks working.

That didn't even work.

I meant to shave the whole thing.

I forgot that up there.

You did not forget the top.

Dude, I hate working from home.

I hate it so much.

Don't worry.

Yeah.

Just like, I don't know, six to eight more weeks of this and then we're back.

If we're lucky.

If we're lucky.

Okay.

So let's do this.

What do we got?

Let's jump right in.

People need.

Okay.

We were, well, we were supposed to talk about why comment or stuff today, but I found,

I want to talk about something that I think is more interesting, but you want to talk

about some lighthearted stuff, which is, what's the sway thing?

Yeah.

What is this way thing?

I saw you.

I saw a video of you dancing.

Was that the first time you'd seen this dance?

Pretty well.

Now I'd seen it.

Ryan Hoover had posted one of him dancing and when he posted it, it looked very real

to me.

Yours did not look that as real.

I think is where you were in your room.

But when I saw that, I was like, holy shit, Ryan could dance.

And then I saw the comments and everyone was like, nice app.

Nice.

How do we get the beta of this app?

And I was like, oh, shit, there's an app that makes you dance.

Wait.

So you have this app.

Okay.

I think it's pretty popular.

It's called sway.

And what it does is you record yourself for 10 or 20 seconds.

You just stand there and you like walk around and move.

And then it uses AI or I don't know what it is, but or not AI, it's called.

Is it?

And then it makes it look like you're dancing like really good.

And I send it to my family and some I made like 20 of them.

They thought I was dancing.

It was hilarious.

Yeah.

It's, it looks pretty, it looks pretty funny.

If they actually just made it a little bit less good at dancing, it would look real.

People would believe it.

But it's like so good that you're like, no way.

No.

It's pretty amazing.

When I downloaded it, it was number 50 in the app store.

And like as I was playing with it, I saw it, it's been climbing up the charts.

And did you just download it because you were browsing the app store or you saw somebody

do it?

So I all, I do, I browse the app store and I like to see the fastest growing apps.

Yeah.

And I like to figure out what's going on.

I do that with gaming all the time.

So I had to figure out the gains that are growing fastest.

So yeah, we're just browsing.

Gotcha.

And, but it is viral.

Like when you see somebody post it, you're like, oh, this is great.

I can, I can, like I should do that.

So it has this kind of like monkey see monkey do virality that I like.

Well, do you remember that app that you would take a picture of your face and it would make

you look older?

Right.

Didn't it turn out that that was owned by a Russian company and they were like doing

funny stuff with your pictures?

But I don't know if they were actually doing anything, but people were definitely sketched

out by it.

They're like, wait, I just gave my camera roll access to some random Russian developer.

Right.

But it's like 50 million other people, like just just to make this like old filter or

baby filter on my face.

Yeah.

So download that app.

It's called sway dance.

Is it called sway?

It's called sway.

For sure.

Yes.

SWAY.

It's a cool little app.

It's good for little pranks.

And actually, you know, that is a lighthearted way to start it because it's just funny and

people should just go to your Twitter and they'll find the video of you doing it.

Um, but this is also like part of this deep fakes, um, like this deep fakes problem.

And so if you don't know what a deep fake is, a deep fake is basically people can now

use, um, technology to make a video look real.

You can make anything look.

So for example, what they do is they'll take Obama Obama's talking.

Yeah.

But I can just say any sentence.

I could just be like, uh, hey, my name's Barak and, um, I'm the worst president of all time

and it'll make it look like his lips are moving to my sentence because they basically feed

in a bunch of footage of Obama talking normally.

And it basically, the algorithm learns, okay, here's how Obama's face moves when he says

certain things.

And then when I, I can input any audio and it'll make it look like he's doing it.

And now right now the technology is where it looks a little off, but it's not that far

off.

Like if I showed it to my, not all of it looks that off, right?

But it's just getting better month over month.

So they just showed a, um, like a paper just came out with a new one and it's literally

just taking a still photo.

So they took the Mona Lisa and then they do the same thing.

I can go say a sentence and it will make the Mona Lisa say it like the, the, the voice

can, can, is that good.

And so like it's pretty crazy that they can just do that off a still photo.

You don't even need like hours and hours of raw footage of the person in order to do this

now.

But what do you think of this whole deep fixing?

Cause it's a big problem.

Like your sister's a lawyer and, um, and I think she was, she was like a DA before,

right?

Yeah.

Uh, well, she was a public defender and then she's a public defender in the Bronx.

And, uh, and people now it's like, if you can't trust what you see, right?

If, if, if audio, like we already have photos that could be Photoshop audio now that can

be, uh, like live bird, uh, I think is the name of it, um, where basically you just,

uh, you can, you, you can train, um, you can train this system to where you can just type

anything and it'll say it in your voice or it'll say it in a Donald Trump's voice.

So if you can't believe what you see, what you hear or what's in video, then, um, how

does that like mess up the world?

Like fake news is going to become a bigger problem.

Yeah.

It's going to become a problem.

But why are we defaulting to that?

Why are we worrying about, I mean, yeah, it's going to be a problem, but also let's think

about all the amazing things.

Like, like act, like there's going to be fake actors, like my dance, like your dance

video.

Yeah.

Like it's going to make movies amazing.

Like, like Brad Pitt won't exist.

It'll be, it'll, well, it will be, it'll be AJ Pitt and it will be some fake person.

And I think that's awesome.

So here's a future world.

You literally are just looking at your computer and instead, like today, if you want to make

a movie or an animation, you have to like be an animator or a movie editor or an artist

to be able to draw.

You're just going to be able to say things and it's going to be able to create what you're,

what you're saying.

So you're going to be able to say, okay, what if Donald Trump was talking to, you know,

whatever, Barack Obama and then Donald jumped in the air and he said this and then literally

it's just going to be able to animate.

That's how, that's how far this is going to go.

And that's going to unlock the ability to create stuff to people who don't have the

technical skills to do it today.

Yeah.

I mean, I'm, but I'm not too worried about how they're going to regulate it because like

if you have a political ad now, it like anyone could run an ad on Facebook or on TV and it

says Donald Trump, I'm Donald Trump and I hate Mexicans.

Anyone could do that now, but I mean, like literally the tech, like you could buy ads,

but there are ways to say like, well, no, that's not allowed.

But it has to say like, I'm Donald Trump and I support this.

You know what I mean?

Like there are ways to like, what do you mean?

Like if you run a TV, a political TV ad right now, it has to say who pays for it.

Sure.

It has to say, is it, but it doesn't have to be, it doesn't have to be a political thing.

Right.

This can go for anyone.

Someone in high school can just bully somebody else.

Like right now the thing that deep fakes got famous because people were putting other

people's faces on porn actors and you could make it look like I could take a photo of

your mom and I could put it on it, put it into a porno and it would look like your mom's

in the porno.

And people were doing this with celebrities, people were doing this with their classmates

and you know, the Reddit, the subreddit for this got huge as r slash deepfakes, r slash

deepfakes.

And so this is how it got popular because it was like this incredible bullying tool.

Like forget about political ads.

It's just like slander left and right.

Did it, did it get taken down that subreddit?

No, I think it's still up.

I'm going to, I haven't been in a long time.

But when it first blew up, you know, it got really popular because people were, you know,

if, oh yeah, it is banned from Reddit now because it was like, it was becoming a problem.

But that didn't stop the actual, the actual problem, that just stopped the subreddit where

people were sharing it.

So I think this is going to be a massive, massive problem for evidence.

I think it's going to become a massive problem for just like slander and spin.

Like I could, I could take a video of you and make it say that you hate Mexican people

and it's not Donald Trump and, and people would believe it because they would see your

face and they would say, I saw him say that, you know?

Yeah, I don't know.

And so I'll tell you what some people are trying to do to combat this is a whole bunch

of programmers who, programmers in general have a high bar for the truth.

They really want things to be true, logical, soluble, reliable.

And so when you take away evidence, evidence which used to be a source of truth, it's like,

well, you're saying this, but I have video of you doing that thing.

So that's evidence.

But now it's like, well, this video could be anything, this video could be fake.

So they're trying to solve this in the way that they think it can be solved.

So the theory is anything you make to sort of validate stuff, the con artist will always

be one step ahead.

And there's too big of a payoff to be able to fake this stuff well.

It's like a counterfeiter.

And so you're always a cat and mouse game, which is not a winning solution.

So the solution that they believe is that the phone makers themselves, the device makers

themselves will need to put a cryptographic seal on the video when it's taken.

And it's like a tamper proof seal, like we have with medicine or whatever, where it's

like, if this seal is broken, that means this video has been edited in some way.

And so at some point people will only trust videos or photos that have this cryptographic

seal on them that says this has not been edited because it's on the device itself and when

it got captured, it gets instantly implemented on.

And so who's working on that?

Well the problem is a startup can't do this, right, because it's actually Apple that needs

to implement it.

It's actually Samsung that needs to implement this.

And so luckily Apple is a pretty privacy conscious company and they know that like if their tools

are being used for evil, they'd usually actually do stuff about it.

So hopefully Apple is working on this, but I have a friend who was doing a startup trying

to do this and he was running into this problem, which is like, look, the people who need to

do this are all the camera makers.

Like the security camera itself needs to do this, and that's the only decent solution.

Now some technical people will say, oh, there's nothing that's actually tamper proof.

You can still get around it, but it's better.

And they are right, but there are still things where it mostly works.

Right, exactly.

So I think that's the way the world is going to work later, where you're going to need

to see this little icon that says, it's like, it's the gluten-free icon.

It's the organic icon.

It's going to be, this is legitimate and there's going to be a legitimacy icon on any photo

or video that's on the show.

Dude, that's the icon business.

That's a good business.

You know JD Power?

No.

I mean, I've heard of it, but I don't know what you're going to tell me right now.

You know what it is though, right?

It's like 455 JD Power Awards.

JD Power and Associates.

That's all I know.

What does that mean?

Okay.

So JD Power, the reason I looked into this, because I wanted to create a business like

this, where I was like, because I was like, this is a fucking racket.

And I'm like, it does sound, it does give a little, it does give value, but you have

to be like a benevolent dictator, where you can rule it, but you really got to be honest

otherwise.

Trust as a service, right?

Right.

And JD Power, what they do is, it's a billion-dollar company, JD Power is.

And I mean, what they do is they test different cars and they give it awards.

But the way that they make money is the car companies are members of the organization.

So if you're like, if you only want the money, you don't give a fuck about being ethical,

you could be like, hey, Ford, our new membership costs us much money, are you guys in or out?

And just so you know, if you're out, we can't give you any awards.

That's crazy.

Yeah.

If you could be in the business of being the rating agency, that is gold.

In fact, one of the problems is like, if people remember during the subprime crisis,

I believe what happened was these subprime mortgages, the bonds that were the securitized

housing bonds, mortgage bonds were rated AAA.

And people were like, well, how is this rated AAA?

This is like a junk bond.

Well, why would it be rated AAA?

And I think I believe this, the companies, I think it was the banks that were funding

standard and poor, right?

So yeah, standard and poor was the rating agency and they were the one sort of funneling

money.

Exactly.

It's the same thing.

It's the same thing.

And so they lost their...

They didn't actually lose it.

They're still around.

They're still one of the kind of main rating agencies.

But like, that's a breach of, breach of trust when the only thing you're providing is trust

as a service.

Yeah.

It's the same thing.

So JD Power was sold to McGraw Hill in 2005 for $400 million.

And then it was sold again recently in 2008, 19, I think for north of a billion.

Right.

I've really been wanting to do the same thing.

Like I've been wanting to create a credentialing agency.

So either in the standardized testing world, so like the way SAT, these things are a racket

because they can charge whatever the hell they want because you need that credential

to move forward.

And these credentials were, for the most part, all these credentials were just created at

one point in time.

And so I was looking into like, is there another credential that I could create that literally

all I'm providing is a stamp?

And I just get paid for the stamp.

Well, you know what I've always wanted to do that similar is a vendors list.

So like, Sean, if you're launching something, you're going to come to me because you think

I know a little bit about copywriting and you're going to say, do you know any copywriters?

And I'm going to be like, I know one or two, but like they're hard to find.

And so in my head, I'm like, I just kind of create Sam's list where it just have like

approved vendors.

And now this is the best, what?

Are you saying this is the best?

Are you saying these are 10 that you should check out?

Or are you saying this is the best one, like Wirecutter?

Well, I don't think you could do the best one because if you have the best copywriter,

that person will always be busy.

But like there are definitely like dozens or hundreds that you can approve.

I mean, I guess Angie's list was something similar and that's huge.

But like I've always wanted to do this for copywriters in particular.

I almost bought Sam, I almost did Sam's list because people are always like, which copywriter

should I do?

I'm like, I don't know, man.

I could post on my social media, but like it's a lot of work for me to go and find them

for you.

But like the same thing with law firms, the same thing with accountants, I'm like, man,

I got to just create like a vendors list of people who I know and approve of.

That's cool.

The version of this I wanted to do was around either IQ.

So I was like, oh, okay, like men's IQ, like, can I basically create some bullshit tests

that essentially labels people?

And then, you know, if you're in the top 5%, you get this extra little certificate.

And so people would pay to be basically have that as a as a bragging, right?

Or I was also thinking about it for developers, like, is there a just an extra credential

you could pay $39 to get that basically says, yes, I know X language or I am competent.

I have this level of competency at this thing, and I'm really a big fan of if anyone's out

there creating a credential, you know, credentialing agency or trust as a service, I'm very, very

interested in those because I think those are beautiful, beautiful businesses, extremely

easy to run, low cost, low risk.

And the more you do it, the more powerful they become because the more you're the more

times you see JD power, even if you don't even fully know what it is, it's like, oh,

we need to go get that.

That's the that's the standard.

So I just looked up Mensa while you were talking.

They have 150, they're a nonprofit, it's 150,000 members, and they do about $4.8 million

a year in sales.

Interesting.

Not that big.

I wonder the backstory.

Yeah, but like as a nonprofit, you never know, like, what's the, what was their motive?

How are they doing things?

Well, but you do know, dude, you can go and look up at all their they have to file a for

a government form and you can see how much the how much they pay themselves, how much

revenue and what their expenses are.

Right.

I guess what I'm saying is I haven't I haven't done that part like the same thing can be

done for athletes, by the way, like, you know, how NFL players go through the combine, which

is basically this battery of tests, you'd run a 40 yard dash, you do this bench press

of 185 pounds, you do a vertical leap test.

And so I really wanted it, I really think that somebody could create a credentialing

thing where you just have this facility in different cities and people pay to come in

to get officially tested to get their scores.

And it's like, here's how good I am as an athlete.

And then they use that when they're trying to basically like get on a you teams or get

college scholarships or whatever it is.

It's like, today we only offer that to NFL players right before they get drafted.

But I think that there should be a sort of a standard service for athletes to say, Hey,

what's my reaction time?

What's my agility test?

What's my vertical?

I did that when I was a kid, when I was in high school, I did the same thing.

It was called spark and okay, SPAR Q and the guy who created it.

It was a X. He was a college, a very elite college runner in the seventies and eighties.

I think his name was Rudy.

I forget his last Rudy Chapa.

I'm remembering his half the top of my head, Rudy Chapa.

He was a two miler from California in high school.

He I think he had the high school state record or a high school national record for the two

mile at like a 30 something.

And his name is Rudy Chapa.

I think, am I right?

Is his name Rudy Chapa?

I'm on the website right now.

I don't see, I haven't looked at his name, but yeah, this looks interesting.

And he was a Nike executive and then he created the SPARQ test and what you did, it was very

similar to a combine and it was, and I did it, I crushed it.

It was a 40 yard, 40 yard dash, a broad jump, a vertical jump, how far you can throw a medicine

ball.

Right.

And maybe that's it.

And they would give you a score and that score and I went to this place called Velocity

Sports and Velocity Sports was created by the coach of LSU to track and field and it

was a chain of gyms that you can go to for high school kids and run and shit like that.

And the Velocity Sports must have paid SPARQ money to use it.

And then when you applied to college, I would put my SPARQ score to get a scholarship.

Yeah, dude, that's exactly what I'm thinking about.

And I'm looking at their website now, it looks very basic, but this is interesting.

I think there's a lot of unused facilities like track and field that are unused so much

of the time that you could do this without capex probably as long as you say like, you

know, when you run a race and it's like, as long as the wind conditions are under this,

then it's in this counts in the official thing.

Right.

So I bet you could use, you know, in the summertime schools that are empty, you could use their

track and field facilities and build a build a program like this because now people with

sports or parents with sports have become so crazy where people are doing travel sports

at like age six, age seven, you're paying thousands of dollars for your seven year old

to play baseball and beyond this like elite team.

This is like a multi-billion dollar industry, the travel sports industry.

And I think all those people would be people who would want to get their kid tested and

you could drive Facebook ads to say, Hey, get your kid tested.

Here's your score.

What's your score?

And then every year you want it upgraded because it's like, oh, I've gotten stronger, faster

and taller.

So I want my official measurements that are that are sort of ratified.

And here's another example of this is, this is kind of funny, we're kind of ranting on

this.

I did zero research on this other than like, I didn't prepare for this.

So I mean, neither.

I just thought of this idea while we were talking.

That's how fucking great we are, dude.

Just take a minute to appreciate that.

You know, Gallup, I do know Gallup.

Yes.

Okay.

So wait, did my microphone, are we, is it good?

Okay, so Gallup is, is a polling service polling company created by this guy named Joseph Gallup,

I think.

And the another company or like a smaller company bought Gallup and it was a family owned business

and the founder of that company that bought Gallup.

His name was, I forget his name exactly, but do you remember strengths finder?

Yes.

And the guy who owned the family business that bought Gallup, he is the author of strengths

finder.

I see.

And so strengths, strengths finder, it's hard for me to say they have a book that is

popular, but it's, even though it's popular, it doesn't make nearly the amount of money

that the company makes.

The company makes about a billion or $2 billion a year.

It's privately owned.

It's probably one of the largest privately owned companies in America, like top 200.

And they have a quiz.

So if you Google strengths finders quiz, it's a $29 or $49 quiz and it tells you where

you rank on strengths finder.

Right.

I've taken it because somebody sent it to me, Jim Clifton is the name of the guy you're

talking about.

Jim Clifton.

Jim Clifton, his dad, Jim Clifton was the CEO of Gallup.

And this was his thing.

And so it was like a survey, they make hundreds of millions of dollars a year off that quiz.

Yes, exactly.

So I've taken strengths finders and I, this is when I was like, oh, this is just bullshit.

Okay.

So first of all, it's a test you cannot fail.

It's just saying, which of these strengths do you have?

So you're just going to get one of the, there's like 25 strengths or whatever.

It's like, here's the five you get, leadership, determination and innovation and whatever.

And then the other person gets like empathy and thoughtfulness and whatever else.

So it's pretty genius and they sell these to companies who want to basically take these

personality tests for leaders to say, hey, we want to understand our employees better.

You want to understand your teammates better.

And this will help you work together better.

And I believe strengths finders was doing like a hundred million plus in revenue.

I'd have to go double check that, but yeah, it's like a tremendously successful franchise.

And the book is really just a, it's like a code you get in the book that says, go take

this quiz online.

And then the book is like kind of useless beyond that, but you have to buy it.

And that shit works really well using that book because like I said, I've kind of talked

about this me and Ramon, we own this, this, this, this software for to do list and we

get all of our signups practically because one guy who has a book mentioned our service

and it gets signed up in the books, not even popular.

That's amazing.

Also, like we had talked about that person in our Facebook group, the my first million

side hustles Facebook group basically who is doing a chess tutoring service, any niche

sport or niche, niche thing like chess, I don't know, there probably is already because

chess is still widely established, but probably is already sort of sort of benchmark or test

you take.

But if I was him, I would basically create my own anyways, which is like, Oh, by the

way, for all my students, like once a year, we do this $100, you know, test and you get

your chess, chess Q score and what your chess Q score tells you your adaptability, your

you know, recognition, cognition, whatever.

And, and it's not like total horseshit, you actually are testing to see how good they

are at certain things.

But I think it's a, it's just a very simple way to make a lot of money off of kind of

vaporware.

There's nothing physical you're doing there, vaporware in that it's real, but it's, it's

lightweight.

It's very simple to create.

It's very simple to maintain.

There's no like employees or assets you need to buy in order to do that.

Well, because Sean, someone in the reviews, our latest review says that you and I are

unethical and that you have to check your ethics at the door.

If you're going to listen to this podcast, which is totally bullshit, but I just want

to make them aware that when you say vaporware, you mean it's real or it's substance.

But yeah, vaporware is the wrong word for it.

What I meant is a very lightweight thing to create and maintain and very low cost to create.

Another example of this is Doug score.

Do you know Doug score?

Never heard of it.

Dude, it's just this guy named Doug Damoro.

He's this nerd, like he's like the nerdiest guy ever and he's got like 4 million subscribers

on YouTube.

And like he's the type of guy who wears like a collared shirt, but like you can see his

white undershirt sticking out from, from like the sleeves, you know, he's like, I know

exactly what he's talking about.

He's like a sloppy, nerdy guy, but he's amazing.

He has a thing where he reviews cars and he creates a Doug score, which is based off of

like, is this fun for a weekend car or is this fun for a daily driver?

And now at this point, he's got a thousand cars that he's ranked.

And I'm when I'm buying my car now, I do it.

I check the Doug score.

I like that.

Okay.

I like the Kelly Blue Book for for value and then Doug score for sort of enjoyment.

I like that.

And Kelly Kelly Blue Book.

Great example.

It's a multi-billion dollar company.

Yeah.

But they, they provide a little different thing.

They have just like a data set that they're able to use to give you a price comparison,

which is like different than sort of an aptitude test.

But nonetheless, I'm curious, do you think we are low ethics?

Do you think you have a sort of a looser ethical criteria than most people for business?

I think that we have a looser attitude.

Yes.

By the way, I think it's significantly above the line of like, good, like, right, like,

for example, most people are like, I can't pre-sell product that I don't have.

And I'm like, in my head, I'm like, who cares?

Just refund the people.

And like, you haven't, you sound like, I'm not saying steal money.

I'm saying advertise something that doesn't exist so you can get demand, improve demand.

And then you refund the money.

I'm not saying you steal from them, but yeah, you are lying.

And so I think that's ethical.

Right.

Yeah.

I think we definitely have a looser definition than the average person, I would say, the

average, maybe the average business person even.

But there is, you know, I think the problem here is there's no standards, right?

There's no, there's no definition for what's ethical, what's not.

It's completely subjective and judgmental.

And so the hard part is, you know, for us, we think there's a line between right and

wrong and we're on the right side.

We think we have a safe margin of a buffer where we're in the right.

But for other people, their line might be in a different spot.

Yeah.

But that's because most people aren't aggressive.

But anything that I do, I would, I would suggest to my mom that she'd buy whatever I'm promoting

or like, it's like, do I want my family to use this or, or if I told them about what

I'm doing, would I like, do I want to hide this?

Right.

So I'm, I'm, anything that I can do, I'm not afraid to tell everyone.

So I met this guy once, this guy had reached out to me about, we're building this product

called Blab.

And Blab was getting popular.

This guy reached out.

He said, Hey, my name is Billy.

I'm from, you know, I forgot where he's from, like Santiago or from Mexico or somewhere

in, in Latin.

And he was like, I'm coming up to California, I'm coming to San Francisco.

I want to meet you.

And I want to talk to you about this company.

And I was like, okay, I don't know about that.

Like most of the people who that are users of a product are not usually people I want

to like do meetings with necessarily, but he said a bunch of stuff in his email that

made him sound amazingly legit.

He was like, my family started the first television station in Mexico.

We, you know, I own all these different like music festivals and he said, he sounded like

super legit, but his email was written with blue text font and like different sizes of

text.

Oh, that was a copy and paste.

Yeah.

Well, no, no, no, not like that.

And he was like, like he had chose like, no, I'm gonna, my emails are blue and not the

like copy paste little purple thing.

It was like, um, this was just his style.

So I was like, I don't know if this guy's a joker or not.

Anyways, we go out to dinner and I have very low hopes.

We go to a sushi place and I walk in and I see probably the most handsome guy I've ever

seen.

And this guy, Billy was extremely well put together.

He's like in a suit and tie.

He looks legit.

We sit down on the table.

He orders the omakase, which is basically chef's choice, like $200 each sushi dinner.

And he's like, I got this.

Don't worry.

And I'm like, okay, I'm starting to believe, but I, you know, could be, could still be

someone who's faking it.

And he starts telling me a story and this guy's completely legit and he's probably the most

charismatic guy I've ever met in my whole life.

I was like, you know, if, if, if I swung that way, I'd be in love right now.

Like this guy is amazing.

So at the end of the dinner, I asked him a question.

I said, Hey, um, you know, you're a very persuasive guy.

Like this was, you clearly are good at this, right?

You're clearly very persuasive, very charming.

I said, I used to think I'm that way until I met you basically.

I used to think I was in the sort of top tier of that.

But I always sort of had this hesitation of like, you know, should I use my, my powers

for good or evil type of thing?

Like, where do you draw the line on using this guy's legit?

He was a real completely legit.

Yes.

And, and so he really was wealthy, very successful, very smart, very charming, all that good stuff.

And so, um, I asked him, I said, you know, what do you think he goes, my rule is this,

he goes, if your intentions are good, then it's all a fair game.

And so he was like, he was like, it all the matters of the intent.

If you're trying to scam people, if you're trying to con people, if you're trying to

not deliver value, if you're trying to just get something that's a good situation for

you and not for the other person, then you shouldn't be doing it.

What you shouldn't be using all these powers of persuasion, but if you think you are genuinely

going to help people, if you think you are genuinely in the right, if you think you're

generally working for a good cause, if your mission is pure, if your intent is good, then

it's all fair game.

You should use it to the max.

And I was like, all right, Billy, thank you very much for this incredible lesson.

I completely agree with him.

And if you study, you know, like persuasion and charm and I use it in the form of copywriting.

That's all.

Some people are born better, but it's a teachable skill.

And I always tell people, like what I'm going to tell you, it's going to sound like evil.

Like I'm going to teach you how to manipulate people, but make sure you use it for good.

Because you can easily use this for bad.

And you know what?

Here's a, here's a weird counter to this.

And this is where, you know, people are going to be like, okay, this guy's actually evil.

Okay.

So the other way of doing this, so the one way, one of the things to say what you just

said, which is use these powers for good.

The other thing I've, I've been able to do is the opposite, which is when I see somebody

do something for evil, but it works, I try to learn from it.

And so for example, remember the first time I saw that I'll give you a recent example

first.

I agree.

So Trump is somebody who I'm not a fan of.

I think the guy is bad in all these different ways, but when I watch him, the guy is an

incredibly effective communicator and he's not polished.

He doesn't use fancy $15 words.

He doesn't have a lot of substance behind what he's saying, but the guy is like a, a

master of, of communication.

The guy knows how to get his point across in a way that resonates with people.

I completely agree.

Scott Adams, who's the creator of Dilbert was talking about this when Trump was running.

If you haven't seen it, go read Scott Adams' blog.

He's the creator of Dilbert and he was early on when Trump first announced his candidacy.

Scott Adams called it.

He goes, this guy's going to win.

And people were like, what?

He goes, I've been studying persuasion for 20 years.

I've been studying hypnosis.

I've been a communicator through cartoon.

I know an effective communicator when I see one.

This guy is a master.

He goes, and so he would come up with, whenever Trump would say things like, um, low energy

Jeb or whatever, or when he would like, call Jeb Bush, low energy, um, he was like, these

are linguistic kill shots.

These are, and when, or when he would talk about the wall, he'd be like, it's a great

big wall, a huge wall.

And he's like, he's painting a picture in people's minds, which is much better than

talking about policy.

And so, so you can learn from people that you think are using it for, well, he, he,

and he called out that he was going to win.

He called it, he was going to win months before anybody even took him seriously.

When 538 was like, this guy's got a 0% chance, Scott Adams was like, this guy's going to

win.

And, uh, of course, if he was wrong, nobody would ever even really pay attention to it

because, you know, but when you're right on a contrary prediction, you get all the credit.

And the other example of this was Hitler.

So Hitler, when Hitler was rising to power, I studied how did this guy get so popular?

What did this guy do?

Cause when you watch him speak, he's not a very compelling guy, um, but, uh, they did

a lot of things.

I remember, uh, that stood out to me this, I was in seventh grade and I remember learning

about this.

And when Hitler was trying to rise to power, all the political campaign posters were all

like full color, lots of text, uh, people trying to explain their position on things.

And Hitler went the other way.

Everything he did was black and white, which would be normally it would not stand out.

But he was like, well, I will contrast everybody else who's using tons of color on their stuff.

I'll go black and white.

The second thing was he would use only like big images and like really powerful images

and not a bunch of texts.

And then he would use movies as propaganda and, you know, fill the cinema with people

to watch a movie, but it was very much a propaganda thing behind it.

So even though he used it for evil, those techniques and principles are interesting to learn from

for me as somebody who wants to, you know, have a strong toolkit that I can use for good.

I completely agree.

I was reading, I've been going out so many Wikipedia holes now that I'm home so much.

I was reading about, uh, I read Hitler's Wikipedia because I was reading about World

War II and it let me like, I was reading about the mafia and then World War II.

And then like, and it was like, he's there like his rise to power was because he, uh,

like would speak at these, uh, I don't know what, what the equivalent of is now, but just

like halls where he, like bars, like veteran halls and I'm like, wait a minute, he started

as a speaker.

That's it.

Right.

It was kind of crazy.

Um, so, okay.

A couple of things.

We'll switch topics because people now are like, what are these guys just saying?

Trump and Hitler are good.

I don't understand.

Um, okay.

So I have an idea for you.

So, um, I call this my new Lambda school idea.

Um, have you ever, do you guys have like an office administrator or office admin?

I don't know if you guys are, we have, yeah, I mean, we have someone who handles stuff.

Yes.

And do you have our things like that?

Right.

So like, um, so admin work or like an executive assistant or secretary, do you have anybody

like that?

Yeah.

Have you ever?

So recently, um, I'm, uh, at my work, we're hiring an EA, right?

So we had an EA, she left, we had to hire a new executive assistant.

And so, um, they put me on the hiring panel and I'm like, okay, I don't even know what

questions I'm supposed to ask.

Like, I don't really know what the background does, should be looking for all that stuff.

So I started thinking about this, started looking it up.

So it turns out that, um, office administrators or, or secretaries or, or executive administrators,

uh, EA's is one of the most popular jobs in the country.

Um, and it's also something where, so there's about, you know, I'd say 600,000, I think

in the U S, um, and they pay pretty well.

Uh, so it doesn't require tons of specialized skill.

It's pretty much anybody can learn to do this if you're, you know, somewhat competent, but

you can make 50, 60, 70, 80 K, um, doing this, I thought that's a pretty good paying job.

And I know at our company, the EA is, they're critical.

Um, they do such an amazing job, they, they're, they, they help and all the senior leaders

do what they do.

And so I started thinking about this and I said, could there be a Lambda school for

EA's?

Because I think this is something that in three months you could teach people the core skills

that you need around calendaring, booking, travel, um, you know, note taking, all the

different sort of core components that you need to do to do this job.

Well, um, you know, it's not rocket science, you just need to learn the tools and learn

the sort of dos and don'ts.

And then I think companies, when, you know, like us, when we're hiring for this, um, there's

no like school or degree that you look at where you're like, Oh, because you have this

degree, you're going to do a good job.

And so it's usually like, do you already have experience doing this or not?

But that's a catch 22 because how do you break in if, if everyone wants to hire for somebody

who already has experience doing it?

And so I'm thinking that you could create a program that, uh, tells, it offers people

who says, Hey, in three months, we can train you for a job that'll pay you 50, 60 or 70

K a year.

And it's a job that has good, you know, work-life balance and all this other characteristics

of it.

And so, and you could use the Lambda school model where you take an income share agreement,

you say, great, I'm training people for three months.

It cost me $3,000 to do this remote virtual school.

But I make back, you know, up to 15 K, 17 K per candidate that gets placed into a job,

uh, over time.

What do you think of this idea?

Fucking love it.

And I'm looking it up right now.

Um, org org.co.

Have you heard of org org?

No, that's a hilarious name though.

We use it.

Um, let's see how big their team is that can kind of tell us how big they are.

But okay.

What org org is, is it's a community slash community slash, uh, job board.

It's like a, I don't know how you would describe it in one word.

It's a org org is a 100% volunteer run organization.

We have jog board, blogs, resources.

We have private groups and an email list and it's all for HR and executive assistants.

Office manager, HR departments and DIY, uh, admin assistant, like, you know, whatever.

It's so, and so my, uh, our old EA was on this and it was an email list and, and they

would send out blasts like, Hey, I'm looking for, uh, the best I, I T person.

Our company's small.

They have a budget of $2,000.

Who do you recommend?

Or like when I wanted to hire a new EA, I had a friend post the listing on there and

I got tons of applicants.

What I would do with your idea is I would either buy this company, man, these, these

the lady who runs this, I forget her name, but she could be making millions off of this.

But I don't think she is.

I bet she's making hundreds of thousands of dollars.

So I would buy that.

I would buy that or become the platinum sponsor for a, you know, fair, a fair rate and use

it for, for the sort of the user acquisition.

And there's this powerful thing because, um, once you build the brand that, Hey, yeah,

this, it's like a staffing agency, right?

But it's a, it's a big internet, internet version of a staffing agency.

And once you place some people, two good things happen.

The first is you get a reputation that says, Hey, our EA's have been hired by company A,

B, C, D, E, and we become, we become a trustworthy source for good EA's.

But then also right now, all the candidates in our current EA pipeline came from our

existing EA's, people they knew from their network.

And so your alumni become your hiring, become your hiring partners.

And so the more alumni you place, the more opportunities you have for your own graduates.

And so I think that's like the real power of, uh, of the Lambda school model and unlike

developers.

Okay.

So the Lambda school model, you got to break that shit down.

Lambda school model, you're saying you train them for free and then you get a percentage

of their salary.

Yes.

Do you love that model for everything?

Uh, not for everything necessarily, but I think when you have a low cost of training,

uh, it's a great model because it reduces the friction to join because you say, well,

it's free.

And so I only, I only have to pay them if I get a high paying job out of this.

So your incentives are aligned, right?

Because we want you to get a high paying job, but you came to us to get a high paying job.

We only get paid if you get a high paying job.

And if you get a high paying job, this is a reasonable payback for, uh, for us providing

that service to you.

And so I think any way, any place where you have a low cost of training, this is a very

good mechanism.

It's not just a debt mechanism.

It gets a lot of hype, but really it's just a debt vehicle and, um, but I think it's

a good debt vehicle for, for this.

Let's, oh, why don't you bring up this Xavier Neal story?

Okay.

Yes.

All right.

So Xavier Neal, I'm sorry.

I feel like I've been talking most of this.

That's okay.

It's, it's really interesting.

So Xavier Neal, uh, is my new favorite billionaire.

So this is my second section.

This is my segment of the show called my new favorite rich guy.

Um, so this guy is essentially like a Elon Musk type of dude in France.

So instead of trying to send rockets to Mars, this guy just operates in his own style, but

he's got the same kind of what I'll call like no flux given, um, attitude, like a Branson

or a Elon Musk.

And I never heard of this guy.

So, um, I'll tell you how I discovered him.

So I discovered him because he created this thing called 42.

Have you ever heard of the school called 42?

Um, no, wait, so he's in France.

He's in France.

Um, he, so I'll tell you his kind of like life story.

So age 19, he creates this business called Minitel.

Minitel is essentially a sex hotline, uh, a phone service, you know, you call, call

like sort of a sex line.

And at 19, he creates this thing and it goes gangbusters.

Um, and so he's doing really well, makes a few million bucks off this.

Then he either creates or invests in buy, buys a stake in something called world net

sold a few, few years later for 50 million bucks right before the dot com crash.

And then his big thing that he did was he created this thing called free and free was

like a T-Mobile.

It's like a mobile carrier and at the time in France, all like SMS phone plans are all

very expensive.

So he created, he undercut everybody.

He created the like lowest cost way to have, you know, a cellular, cellular service.

And so free became this, um, huge company.

So his, his net worth balloon to like $6.6 billion.

I'm looking him up now.

This guy's my favorite person ever.

Yeah.

And he's, he's very legit.

And so he was like, all right, look, um, what do I want to do now?

I want to do more baller shit.

And so he was like, okay, I'm going to create this thing called 42.

So he was like, I'm going to create a computer science school with no teachers and no staff.

So all he did was create this dope facility with a bunch of computers.

And if you get into 42, you just come and, uh, the computer is your lesson plan.

So it's like a video game.

There's like a challenge.

It's like, Hey, you need to make a website that can do X, Y and Z.

And you're like, okay.

And it's like, you have the internet and you have some people next to you.

And like, you guys need to figure out how to get past this level.

And so you start doing the program.

So it's self-serve.

You do it.

You do, um, a bunch of like projects to level up plus you create your own, you know, like

projects or ideas.

So somebody created, I don't know, like, uh, somebody could create like a Corona virus

tracker right now because that's a timely little website.

Yeah.

I'm looking it up now.

They have 2,500 students.

Yeah.

And it's actually closed right now because the physical facility closed here.

But it was a wild idea.

I don't even know how successful it's been.

I don't think it's been a wild success, but I love his bet.

So he was like, yeah, I'm going to put $150 million into this.

So he built one in France and he built one here in Fremont for $100 million in California.

And um, it was just like, so what a, what a radical idea.

What a way to bet your money and try to like change the world over and over and over again.

And then he did this thing in, in France, he's like, okay, how do I build the like startup

ecosystem here?

So he created this thing called station F. And if you look at this thing, it's like

the fucking NASA facility.

It's like this huge, huge, like, like, I don't know how many football fields, long office

or hangar or co-working space.

And he's like, all right, I'm going to make the dopest place for any investor to come

when they're in Europe.

Here, here's some space to go hang out entrepreneurs, you're starting companies, come over here

and build your company.

Here's an office space, um, restaurants come here at the bottom, fill this place up, you

know, Jim, whatever.

So he created his own little Oasis kind of like Tony Shay did in Vegas.

This guy did in France.

This guy's amazing.

I just love this guy's style.

So first of all, I've looked it up now.

He's not perfect.

2004, he was indicted and detained for a month for misuse of company assets, which occurred

in several of his sex shops that he was a shareholder in.

And he ended up getting a two years suspended prison sentence for misuse of company assets.

So he's certainly not perfect.

I don't know.

I'm just reading off this one thing though.

In addition to all this, he owns the rights of the song My Way by Frank Sinatra, which

I love.

He owns one of the largest newspapers in France.

It was super interesting guy.

What I'm curious about people like this and Andrew Wilkinson is going to be on the pot.

Is he going to be on this Tuesday?

Uh, yeah.

Next, the next episode, basically.

So Andrew kind of, Andrew, not exactly, but kind of does it in the same way as well.

And so we have to ask him about this.

What I want to know is how do these people manage so many freaking projects?

Right.

Because like I, I can't even manage what I have on my plate and like, right.

So it's kind of prolific.

So they, you know, they hire, they hire people to run their shit.

Right.

So like I worked with a guy, Michael Burch, who's kind of like this, like billionaire

type of dude.

And he created this incubator with this totally different model or everybody owns all the

equity and all the projects.

And you know, he picked me to run, that's run the show for him.

So he trusted me.

He's pretty hands off.

We checked in, but like he'd let me run the show.

So I was looking at this guy Xavier Neal and he's got somebody, this woman from Google

who runs station F, the big, the big facility.

He's got somebody who runs his investment fund and the guy, that guy was telling the

story.

He goes, you know, um, we don't have board meetings, but I was like, uh, Xavier, don't

you want to know what I'm doing with your fund?

And he's like, yeah, yeah, for sure.

Tell me.

And he's like, um, he goes, I told him, I said, Hey, we invested in all these companies.

I think we should double down on these winners and, uh, make, make less small investments

and do more on the winning companies.

And what do you say?

Okay.

He goes, he goes, I'm not, I'm not doing this to make more money.

I'm doing this to make more companies, invest in more companies.

And the guy was like, what?

He's like, he's like, you could double down, but don't stop investing in new and like new

small small companies.

Uh, and then the other thing that they talked about in his thing, kind of like what you're

saying, how do you manage this?

They're showing like, uh, the guy showed his email inbox, all the emails from this guy.

And I've noticed this, a lot of wealthy, busy people, their emails look like text messages.

So like this guy will write him a long email about like, Hey, we're thinking about this

plan.

Here's what we could do.

Here's their prize.

Okay.

Cool.

We could do you all good.

And it's like up the number two, the letter you.

Where do I see this screenshot?

Uh, there was a story.

I think it was like a Forbes or Bloomberg story or something about this guy.

Um, and they, they put that in there, but I think there's a pretty common thing amongst

the people who do a lot of stuff.

I guess it's kind of like, if I buy like, uh, like I've talked about how I'm, I'm going

to buy like just a toy car, like a fun car.

I guess it'd be like the equivalent of me buying like a $10,000 car and like letting

someone use it and it's like, dude, I don't care, just make sure it comes back in one

piece.

Right.

And so, you know, the thing, I guess the thing I want to clarify, because when Andrew's

coming on on Tuesday, I'm, I like Andrew for the same reason I like this guy and they're

totally different.

Right.

Andrew's not gone to jail and didn't start a sex hotline and it's not a billionaire.

And like, well, we don't know that for sure.

Yeah.

Well, not public.

This guy has about 20 years on Andrew.

So give him time.

Uh, but I guess like the thing, the thing that stands out to me is I respect above all

else people who do shit their own way.

People who have their own, their original thinkers and decide to live life on their own terms.

That's kind of what I got out of this guy is I think I feel like this guy, Branson, Elon

Musk, the thing I like about them and they're definitely have lots of flaws and lots of

effing, you know, messed up things that they do, but I just respect that they don't just

follow a normal societal playbook.

They live life on their own terms.

They, they, they, they basically, you know, marshal to be their own drum or whatever.

That's what I like about them.

That's what I like about Andrew.

He's done it completely his way, which is very non-traditional.

Do you think this guy speaks good English?

The French guy?

Yeah.

Let's, uh, I bet he's all right.

Let's fucking email him.

Yeah, let's do it.

I'm looking at him now.

I, I mean, I would, if you're French, I mean, if you're a magnet like this, I would imagine

you, you speak some English, but is he, uh, he speaks good enough English to be on this.

I'm sure he speaks.

I'm sure.

He's French, dude.

Uh, we will, we will make it happen if we need to.

Yeah.

It'll be like a YOL, YOL Romero on Joe Rogan, where he just has a translator on the podcast.

I'm down.

I would love to do this.

And this guy's in cahoots with, uh, this other guy who I don't want to say his name

because it's too embarrassing if I've pronounced, if I try to say it, say it because he's French,

but it's Bernard R. Nalt.

Do you know who that is?

He owns LBMH.

Oh, okay.

I'll tell you really quick.

He's usually goes back and forth with Gates and a few of these other guys as the richest

guy in the world.

He L, LVMH, it, uh, stands for Louis Vuitton, something, uh, but they own, um, Chanel, they

own Louis Vuitton.

They own, um, it's the largest luxury group in the world.

They own Fent, Fent, um, what's the, uh, Rihanna, yeah, they own that.

So the way he started it was his father was wealthy and they owned a, uh, construction

business.

And it was big, but it wasn't like billionaire big, but, um, I think they sold it for like

$20 million in, uh, in the sixties, which is a lot of money that, I mean, that's probably

the equivalent of, uh, 20 million, that's probably the equivalent of a hundred million

now.

So it's a lot of money.

Um, and so anyway, he convinced his father when this guy, Bernard was in his twenties

and he goes, dad, we gotta diver, we gotta sell our construction business and buy luxury

goods, cause when I went to New York, they all knew what Chanel was, but that's not

even a big company.

And so he goes, let's fucking buy Chanel.

And so they bought Chanel for a small sum, millions of dollars, but not what it's worth

now.

And then he runs it and he starts buying more and more and more.

So he turned a construction company into the owner of Louis Vuitton and dude, they own

a lot of shit.

So let me just throw out some names.

So they own Belvedere, they own Hennessy, they own Dior, they own Fenty, they own Fenty,

they own Tag, um, they own Hublot, they own Moe, they own, I mean, this is, this is like

a, like, I don't know a luxury brand that's not on this list.

Yeah.

They own it all.

Like, do they, but then like Gucci, I think Gucci is its own brand.

Yeah.

It's kind of like, you know, like the A, B and B, where it's like two companies own

like all the other sub companies.

Yeah.

Well, this freaking guy did it and he, it started as a construction business.

Right.

So it doesn't happen that much anymore, but this is what I love about business before,

for some reason it seemed like this happened, this, this used to happen a lot more.

The Chinese are notorious for doing this, where they diversify like crazy.

So I don't think this doesn't happen more.

I think this is just something that happens on like a 50 year horizon.

And so it's just hard for us who like, we're just for five years, we've just been furiously

looking at this for 10 years, uh, to see these things that are playing out over 50 or a hundred

year arcs.

Right.

So it's like, re with you, but I studied a handful of Chinese companies that were launched

in the nineties and two thousands and they are like crazy about doing that.

Right.

Um, where like they would start something and like two years later, they own like apartment

buildings.

It's like, what the heck?

That's not even like, and, and, um, the Japanese, uh, have done it as well.

They, they have a name for it.

I don't want to pronounce it because I don't want to butcher it.

I don't even know how to say it.

It starts with the K, Kazoo, I think, um, and it, and it, and it's basically, it's kind

of like how, do you know how Yamaha makes motorcycles, pianos and chainsaws and power

bloat?

It's kind of like that.

Like they, like are known for doing that.

And so what are you?

Okay.

So I was saying what I respect the most bank did it too.

Right.

So what I was saying was I, what I respect the most is people who, who, you know, create

their own playbook on how they want to live their life and what, what would be your cause

like, I think you kind of like the like mogul types.

You love researching.

What do you think?

I think it's like your highest, highest bit thing you respect people who the same.

You said it best.

I agree with what you said.

People who, um, people who look at the world and be like, yeah, I get it.

The world's this way.

I'm going to bend the world to make it my way though.

And have you, uh, like in your own small way, do you think, have you done that?

Like, what's an example of where you've bent the world into working the way you want it

to work?

I think that I'm from Missouri.

I think that some of my friends from Missouri think that I have done that.

Um, I do not think that I have done that, right?

But I think give it time and I will, I think some of the things you did with the hustle

were like that.

So for example, um, you didn't go to the VC route.

In fact, you did some weird shit, like crowdfunding and other stuff along the way.

Um, and from the beginning, I think you, I remember you distinctly saying, cause I was

like, why don't you do Facebook, you know, why don't you do video?

Why don't you snapchat?

This is hot.

And you were like, no, I want to do email because that's my own little pirate ship that

I can own.

And I'm not, I don't have dependent on any other platform.

I want to make my own pirate ship and I want to get my pirate ship to be a big fucking

pirate ship.

And I just never really heard anyone talk like that or think like that where they were

so, um, specific around the, like, um, the path to victory.

Dude, I have a video like I'm, I'm normally, I try not to brag on myself because I think

I got a lot of flaws, but the way our company is shaping now, I made a video in 2015 and

I outlined what was going to happen and it is 100% happening exactly like that.

Where's that video?

It's on YouTube.

If you Google the hustle seed invests, I explain, I go, we're going to build to a million people.

We're going to profit from advertising and we're going to use all that profit to build

more stuff.

And we're going to sell that stuff and then we're going to build more media around it.

And it is happening exactly.

And do you know how you said pirate ship?

Let me show you something.

Hold on.

Let me show you something.

Stay there.

All right.

I'm off camera, so I'm going to show you why you're going to see what I'm doing.

Sam just dropped his pants and I'm looking at a giant pirate ship tattoo on his thigh.

When did you get that?

In 2000, like right around when I was telling you about the company, I got a pirate ship

and it says bold, fast, fun and that's how you tattooed your business plan under your

thigh.

Yes.

I love it.

What I go email list is our pirate ship and every email is a little bit of wind in our

sales.

I love it.

That's great.

Okay.

We got an end on that.

That's a classic.

I should have taken a screenshot of that one.

Okay.

So we will see you guys Tuesday.

We're going to have Andrew on when we say Tuesday, that's when we record these come

out.

I look like a freaking loose cannon right now with a Mohawk and tattoos.

I'm not actually like that.

All right, man.

I will.

I'll catch you later.

I'm going to have Andrew on when we say Tuesday, that's when we say Tuesday, that's when we

say Tuesday, that's when we say Tuesday.

That's when we say Tuesday, that's when we say Tuesday.

I'm going to have Andrew on when we say Tuesday, that's when we say Tuesday.

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Machine-generated transcript that may contain inaccuracies.